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EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

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Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#601

Post by vlovich123 »

kashyapc wrote: post #588
fuzzybear3965 wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems that USB-C for _Lenovo_ laptop power ports seems to be incredibly flaky. I have 2 year-old HP Spectre x360 and a new Framework and I've had no problems with charging either of them from a number of different USB-C cables, wall adapters, and even a power delivery monitor (Dell U2520D).

I thought so too, that this may be Lenovo-specific. But the Lenovo technician claimed: "this is not Lenovo-specific, it happens with other laptops too". I just naively took his word. Good to know that it works reliably with other vendors.

I don’t think I’ve ever had a problem with laptop USB-C chargers. It may happen with other laptops but it’s hard to estimate how big of a problem it is.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#602

Post by smoldesu »

izacus wrote: post #570
smoldesu wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a launch-model Switch, and it still has trouble charging even on latest firmware. It's very possible that this is one of the "Mariko" fixes; Nintendo silently released a refresh of the Nintendo Switch before the OLED model was announced, dubbed the Mariko models. These had a number of changes, including but not limited to: - New, more secure boot sequence - Updated Nvidia Tegra board - ~20% better battery life…

The change has to have come earlier, my pre-Mariko Switch had no troubles charging from multiple phone, MacBook, tablet and 3rd party USB-C chargers.

It's interesting, that does seem to be what people are reporting... I wonder if that suggests that an IC redesign came before Mariko but after launch?

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#603

Post by nayuki »

mlindner wrote: post #447

Imagine they had made this dumb decision back when Micro USB was the standard. We would have never gotten anything better than Micro USB. Governments shouldn't be in the market of mandating that a specific technical standards must be used as it freezes innovation. Also purely in terms of usability, the Apple thunderbolt plug is easier to clean and less error prone on insertion as it self-centers.

Thunderbolt has the same connector as USB-C. Surely you mean Apple Lightning.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#604

Post by mattmaroon »

Someone wrote: post #388
mattmaroon wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really get this trash argument even though I hear it over and over. I throw away a higher volume of stuff in one or two average days than all the wall warts and phone cables I've ever owned probably add up to. I've been on smart phones since Blackberry, and I don't think all of the chargers and cables I've used over the two decades combined add up to a single trash can full. Interoperability sure.

> I throw away a higher volume of stuff in one or two average days than all the wall warts and phone cables I've ever owned probably add up to. I would think ‘mass’ is a better metric to use than ‘volume’. Also, it’s not only the waste, but also the work needed to make it, and I would guess that’s a lot harder for electric chargers than for, say, the plastic bags that take up the bulk of the volume of trash. Also, “O…

I would think volume is a better metric because landfills don't really much care about mass.

If you wanted to save trash you'd probably go after packaging. Ban disposable water bottles (or something less drastic like taxing them extra) and there's 50 lifetimes of wall warts per person per annum.

This just isn't really an enviromental problem. Or if it is, it's so far down the scale as to be pointless to prioritize over almost anything. It's really about competition.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#605

Post by atoav »

tediousdemise wrote: post #545
bloppe wrote: post #485

A lot of people saying "USB-C cables aren't even compatible with each other!" (Nintendo switch etc.) Guess what: that's exactly the problem this regulation is intended to solve. Fake USB-C cables like Nintendo's that have the right shape but do not adhere to spec should gradually disappear along with lightning cables. The regulation actually says that cables can no longer be bundled with the devices themselves, so Ni…

It's kind of sad to me that Apple doesn't make Lightning an open standard. In all my years, I haven't had a single Lightning connector fail on me. The solid metal where the contacts reside is just too robust to wear out or get damaged (unless you somehow step on it the right way or let it corrode). USB-C connectors, on the other hand, seems to loosen after a rather small number mates and de-mates, leading people to u…

I connect disconnect the same USB-C connector minimum 8 times a day for 4 years now. I have yet to have any issue with it. USB micro B connectors that got the same treatment repeatedly failed.

The USB C jacks I have seen on PCBs so far seem all to look pretty solid to me, although I am convinced you can also get cheap ones that will just happily fail if you just tried. Getting cheap Lightning connectors will be a lot harder, for obvious reasons.

So if we do the comparison between Apple and something else, let's not fall into the old trap of comparing an 1000€ ios device to an 100€ android device and declaring android to be unusable.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#606

Post by WanderPanda »

tediousdemise wrote: post #561
baq wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cables though… they used to be a joke. I’ve wrapped mine with electrical tape near ends so they last longer.

Definitely, those Apple-supplied cables suck hard. Adding little tension relief springs[0] to the ends can protect them if you don't want to buy another (or more robust) cable and create more e-waste. You can find the springs in clicky pens. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCIo8xGTUX0

The Apple supplied cables seem to be quite environmentally friendly already since they literally rot at the ends. Not only lightning but also the MagSafe ones. The Lightning connector itself mechanically is the best connector I've ever encountered, though. Pure satisfaction when plugging it in, even after 5 years or so

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#607

Post by geysersam »

ericmay wrote: post #255
mrtksn wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU is a densely populated place where having multiple charging networks of incomparable plugs will be horrible. When you are not happy with decisions the governments make, it usually means that you should be involved in the process of making the decisions. Europeans don't trust that the industry will always come up with the best solutions for the user, Americans usually don't trust the government doing something well…

> EU is a densely populated place where having multiple charging networks of incomparable plugs will be horrible. In the short term, yes. In the long term however competition between these different standards will cause consolidation and overall technology improvement. The next step will be regulating wireless charging so that all devices have to use/do the same thing, rinse-wash-repeat. > Europeans don't trust that…

> being granted a monopoly

Anyone can produce USB-C chargers. That's not a monopoly. This will effectively enable competition on the charging market, since the big players can't bind their products to their own proprietary chargers anymore.

Have you ever felt the Apple/Microsoft charger to be lacking in some way? Breaking easily, too long cords, too short, wrong color, too expensive? Congratulations now you can make and sell those better chargers. Before, this was not possible.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#608

Post by mytailorisrich »

samatman wrote: post #211
mrtksn wrote: post #123

By the way, that's also how Tesla and all other cars have the same electric plug in EU(not the USB mandate but the car plug standardisation mandate). Of course, the first thing that comes to mind is what happens if better solutions are found. Will EU block innovation? That question is addressed in the Q&A: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... In essence, they seem to believe that wired char…

> Will EU block innovation? It already has. Tesla's connector is nicer (you can call that subjective but it isn't) and the supercharging network in the US is deploying the clunky standard sort of connector as well. If EU legislation were universal, that would preclude any future where the superior connector is licensed and takes over from the crappy designed-by-committee alternative, because Tesla would be forced to…

It makes sense for cars to have a standard connector so that they may be charged without any problem at any public charging station. After all, there is a standard fuel nozzle for ICE vehicles.

On the other hand, this requirement to have an USB-C connector is pretty useless to downright counter-productive as it will indeed prevent innovation. It's just political hand-waving.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#609

Post by bushbaba »

leadingthenet wrote: post #506
bloppe wrote: post #485

A lot of people saying "USB-C cables aren't even compatible with each other!" (Nintendo switch etc.) Guess what: that's exactly the problem this regulation is intended to solve. Fake USB-C cables like Nintendo's that have the right shape but do not adhere to spec should gradually disappear along with lightning cables. The regulation actually says that cables can no longer be bundled with the devices themselves, so Ni…

> Let's say the USB consortium releases USB-D with input from Apple, Google, and many other stakeholders [...] If you have to make such an argument, you've already lost. Innovation, particularly disruptive and / or breakthrough innovation, does not happen by committee, no matter how many times over history people tried deluding themselves into thinking that it does. So no, it's not fine.

Well, innovation does shift to circumventing the regulation. Such-as removal of the charging port all together, and moving to magsafe-qi charging https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MHXH3AM/A/magsafe-charger
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