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EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

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Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#371

Post by maccard »

rbanffy wrote: post #93
maccard wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how am I supposed to know that when looking at a device that has a USB-C port for charging, and the instructions on the charger [0] say "Nintendo Switch can be charged by plugging the AC adapter into the console's USB Type-C connector." [0] https://store.nintendo.co.uk/en_gb/-nintendo-switch-power-ad...

According to this regulation, it seems devices and cables must be clearly marked as for what they can do.

The only comment I could see in the article on that topic is this:

> the EU simply said that "consumers will be provided with clear information on the charging characteristics of new devices, making it easier for them to see whether their existing chargers are compatible.

Which is super disappointing, as the person who wrote TFA clearly didn't read anything other than the press release. The actual supporting documentation is here [0] and says:

> on the packaging or a label, manufacturers would have to provide information on specifications relating to charging capabilities, in line with annex Ia (amended Article 10(8) RED). This includes a description of the wired chargers' power requirements (the text displayed should read: 'The minimum power delivered by charger shall be equal or higher than [xx] watts') and specifications on charging capabilities ('USB PD fast charging' and an indication of any other supported charging protocols).

Which is still not great - this doesn't cover cables for example, and it doesn't guarantee that it will be printed on the device. Here [1] are apples chargers in the UK - unless they're side by side it's impossible to tell which one of those chargers is which, and even at that unless you know for sure one of the devices is X, its' really quite difficult to tell.

[0] https://www.europarl.europa.eu/thinktank/en/document/EPRS_BR... [1] https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/accessories/all/made-by-apple?...

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#372

Post by andrewla »

mmastrac wrote: post #360
andrewla wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not correct so far as I can tell -- the amendment to directive 2014/53/EU [1] says > Hand-held mobile phones, tablets, digital cameras, headphones, headsets, handheld videogame consoles and portable speakers, in so far as they are capable of being recharged via wired charging, shall: > (a) be equipped with the USB Type-C receptacle, as described in the standard EN IEC 62680-1-3:2021 ‘Universal serial bus inte…

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... "Any technological developments in wired charging can be reflected in a timely adjustment of technical requirements/ specific standards under the Radio Equipment Directive. This would ensure that the technology used is not outdated." "At the same time, the implementation of any new standards in further revisions of Radio Equipment Directive would need to…

I don't see how this is relevant -- this is a statement of principle. The fact remains that to update the standard, the "timely adjustment" would be made by the legislative body. Don't let the passive voice fool you here; this is not some dynamic industry-led process, it's just a non-binding commitment to update the regulations if the technology advances.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#374

Post by xeromal »

rootusrootus wrote: post #231
marticode wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USB-C is highly extensible (some would say way too much), I doubt we will need to make a connector that is physically incompatible anytime soon (although I'm sure the standard will be upgraded for more speed/uses)

> I doubt we will need to make a connector that is physically incompatible anytime soon Didn't USB-C already do that to itself? I suppose that depends on how narrow the definition of "physically incompatible" is. But IIRC you can't buy a perfect do-everything USB-C cable today, because some USB-C use cases are flat out incompatible with others.

I believe those are just shitty implementations of the spec. If you buy high quality gear with high quality specs, it should work ok.

The Nintendo switch is a pile of shit though.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#375

Post by tacitusarc »

theplumber wrote: post #287
samatman wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a citizen of the EU, so your various centrally-planned interventions in the world economy affect me without any possibility of representation. It leaves me hoping your economy becomes much smaller so Asia can start ignoring it. Or reform I guess, the vote is yours, not mine.

Imagine different gasoline plugs...that would be stupid, isnt't it? Or different fuel formula for different car models or different AC sockets in the same house... Also I'm not sure why you hold Asia so dear. You may soon get some centrally planned standards from China in the EV market and not only(i.e online services such tiktok)

I was unable to find any record of legislation forcing standardization of gas pump form factors. Also, in my experience different pumps operate at different rates. I think the fact that pumps tend to be quite similar is a result of their mechanical nature, where less precision is required.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#376

Post by ryathal »

sxg wrote: post #104
akmarinov wrote: post #97

That's very interesting, not because the new iPhone would have a USB-C, but due to the fact that Apple continues selling older phones. Currently they sell the SE, 11, 12 and 13 By 2024 they will be selling a SE, 13, 14 and 15. Will they rework the SE, 13 and 14 to get USB-C? Will they stop selling them just in Europe? That's potentially a lot of money left on the table.

They will almost certainly be grandfathered in. Legislation nearly never retroactively applies to things created before the legislation itself.

That's a pretty huge leap. Just because a design existed before regulation doesn't mean you can keep making it after the regulation. I would be surprised if Apple was allowed to keep selling non-USB-C phones manufactured in winter 2024 or 2025. They will likely be allowed to sell existing inventory, maybe offer refurbished phones that aren't compliant.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#377

Post by heretogetout »

tacitusarc wrote: post #375
theplumber wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine different gasoline plugs...that would be stupid, isnt't it? Or different fuel formula for different car models or different AC sockets in the same house... Also I'm not sure why you hold Asia so dear. You may soon get some centrally planned standards from China in the EV market and not only(i.e online services such tiktok)

I was unable to find any record of legislation forcing standardization of gas pump form factors. Also, in my experience different pumps operate at different rates. I think the fact that pumps tend to be quite similar is a result of their mechanical nature, where less precision is required.

Check this out:

> (f) Every retailer and wholesale purchaser-consumer shall equip all gasoline pumps from which gasoline is dispensed into motor vehicles with a nozzle spout that meets all the following specifications:

> (1) The outside diameter of the terminal end shall not be greater than 0.840 inches (2.134 centimeters).

> (2) The terminal end shall have a straight section of at least 2.5 inches (6.34 centimeters).

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/40/80.22

Edit: fixed formatting

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#378

Post by ryathal »

ospzfmbbzr wrote: post #311

I'm all for stopping Apple,Sony, or other nasty megacorps from including deliberately 'unique' cables that cost a fortune to replace -- but when the bureaucrats get involved in anything, particularily technology, it frequently ends up being a disaster. This is for a few reasons not the least of which is that the types who are in government are not the types who can make anything useful let alone novel. Even worse the…

Every useful technology has some level of Bureaucratic regulations attached to it. there are very few exceptions and they don't hurt any sort of growth or innovation. Cars, planes, electric outlets, the internet, radio, television, railways, and more are all regulated to some degree. There are as many examples of regulations driving innovation as there are limiting it.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#379

Post by pmyteh »

rand49an wrote: post #350
kube-system wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny, because all of North America uses the NEMA standard and the EU uses a bunch of different plugs.

Probably why they are more conscious it's a problem then.

Yeah. The rollout of domestic wiring standards was pre-EU, and dealing with the entrenched incompatible standardisation gets in the way of the EU goal of a single market in goods and services. They really don't want more arbitrary standards that vary nationally.

Of course, that's not quite the same as the laptop charger question where the fragmentation is between companies and less entrenched. But still.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#380

Post by vel0city »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #188
Hamcha wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a new thing. Car design has been dictated by regulations for decades and while I'm sure it has definitely stopped some novel designs from getting out there, I think we can be mostly thankful that we don't live in a sea of heterogeneous (let alone hazardous) designs. Cars can still look cool, but not to the point of being a detriment. USB-C is a pretty lax standard (for good and bad) and at the end of the day…

> Cars can still look cool compare cars from 40s-70s to what came after, its a different world you can argue it was worth it, but you can’t argue cars didn’t get homogeneous and boring in the process

A 1964 Ford Galaxie 500 had a wheelbase of 119" and was 210" long.

A 2021 Mustang Mach E has a wheelbase of 107" and is 188.5" long.

Which one is humongous?

Even if you looked at the original 1964 Mustang, its not that much smaller than the Mach E which is a 5-door crossover. The '64 had a wheelbase of 108" and an overall length of 181.6", just 7 inches shorter for a coupe.

Older American cars were often land yachts. The old family sedan of the 1960s are often larger than crossovers of today, they just don't sit as high.

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