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High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

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Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#161
This is only one piece of the puzzle. Another is the significant reduction in state funding to colleges.

In particular, funding cuts are somewhat cyclical, occuring during economic downturns. Higher Ed funding always looks like the low-hanging fruit to cut. Health and social services, corrections (prisons) and K-12 education are much more problematic from a political optics viewpoint. Higher Ed is, in some sense, still seen as "optional" in the sense that people can live without it and because colleges do have an alternative revenue stream.

I've seen colleges have funding for basic things like updating crumbling infrastructure pulled mid-summer when states finalize budgets and a 5-year infrastructure program from the state is cut off in year three. This makes it very difficult for budget planning, and it's not uncommon for schools to then have to put out a bond to finish funding things itself.

A third factor is a sort of toxic arms race between colleges to recruit new students. In the wake of revenue uncertainty colleges of course try to increase their their enrollment to boost revenue. It has turned into a negative sum game, a college builds shiny new dining or housing facilities to attract new students, and the school down the road loses enrollment & revenue as a result which means they need to spend money building such things just to not lose students. Meanwhile the old facilities were perfectly adequate though by no means luxurious. Students going through the recruitment meat grinder are then making choices based on whether or not the school has various food franchises on campus. Schools doesn't have a Starbucks or even a Dunkin Donuts? Can't go there!

I don't know the solution to that one. The first schools that did it gained a brief competitive advantage but now it's more of an equilibrium where all schools have to do it just to tread water.

Anyway, it's all much more complicated than simply changing the loan structure (which of course was a big part of things as well.)

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#162
post #119
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that argument, everything is "buying votes". There are far more blatant examples of vote buying, like creating jobs in the production of weapon systems for the military, tax cuts for specific groups (mostly the rich, though that's more "buying campaign donations"), and plenty of other examples. The fact of the matter is that these loans are unsustainable. They saddle people with life-long debt that they can never…

The examples you gave are not as direct. This is a direct stimulus that can easily be attributed from the government to an individual. In some cases, as you mentioned, there are political reasons that are also suspect and stupid in my opinion. However, this example is extremely simple and easily attributable as there isn’t some 3rd party hiring people or some number of dollars you get to keep in your bank account in…

I think the other examples are far more blatant. Politicians fund the military by far more than the military needs, to the point that the military doesn't even know what to do with it, but there's always conditions that specific military or NASA projects take place in specific states or districts for specific politicians. The tax cuts for donations are even worse. And neither of those are solving a specific problem, which is definitely the case with the crippling student loans.

That said, I agree with you on bankruptcy being a better idea. From what I understand, these loans are harder if not impossible to get rid of through bankruptcy than other loans, despite being far more crippling.

In general, I'd like a rule that all interest-carrying loans must be able to be eliminated through bankruptcy. Only interest-free loans should be exempt. Also: a cap on student loans to discourage excessive tuition. Tuition is just insane (and where is that money going? I hear plenty of younger professors are struggling too).

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#163
post #36

So where is the money going? If the price of something is increasing faster than inflation then I expect something in return for the extra money I am paying like a bigger house, faster computer, whatever. I went to college in the 1990's. Are college students getting a better education or experience for all the extra money they are paying? I've seen my university's new classrooms, student center, library, dorms, etc.…

The money is going into a bottomless pit of administrative and bureaucratic overhead. Universities are caught up in a zero-sum competition for the top students (and athletes). To attract these students they invest in massive infrastructure projects (new buildings and renovations), often with the support of earmarked donations from wealthy alumni. These new facilities must then be staffed with administrators and maint…

> The money is going into a bottomless pit of administrative and bureaucratic overhead. Universities are caught up in a zero-sum competition for the top students (and athletes). To attract these students they invest in massive infrastructure projects (new buildings and renovations), often with the support of earmarked donations from wealthy alumni. These new facilities must then be staffed with administrators and maintenance workers. Along with the new facilities come new departments and schools of X and Y which also need their own administration.

> The short answer is: administrative bloat.

I don't get it -- you're saying it's "bloat" and bad that the competitive market for students is causing universities to invest in themselves?

You've actually convinced me that a large chunk of costs for nameless "administrators" might be going to useful purposes because investing in buildings and programs requires non-educational staff to keep things going.

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are municipal resource colleges. They're called community colleges. They are extremely affordable. Very few people want to go there.

few people want to go there because the bit of paper you get at the end is the value and those a worth less than the bits of paper you get from other universities.

If you go to a community college for two years (nominal) and transfer to get a bachelors degree in two more years (nominal), you end up with the same piece of paper as if you had done all four years at that same place. Your bank balance (and life experience) would likely be different however.

Of course if you get through only two years, you'll (optionally) have a piece of paper, which might be better than dropping out of a four year school two years in.

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#165
post #30

State funding per student has steadily declined since 1987. Tuition rates have risen in response. I don’t claim all of the tuition increases have come from the decline in funding but the decline in public funding contributes to the increase. Public colleges are more and more being run like businesses. According to this research, public funding for higher education has declined in response to increased welfare and Med…

"State funding for higher education has declined by roughly a quarter, to $7,152 per student enrolled in a public two- or four-year school in 2015, down from $9,489 per student in 1987." The article is not in disagreement with the thought that Free Federal Money displaces other sources. Also, the article does not show why tuition has risen 1200% instead of 30%.

The linked article doesn't say it's constant dollars, that's probably a far bigger change than it looks like.

Also, note that the relationship is non-linear: Suppose it really is constant dollars and constant costs and it really costs $10k/quarter/student and look at the numbers: $511/quarter in 1987, $2,848 in 2015--a 30% drop in funding leads to a 557% increase in tuition.

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

College is still the best investment you can make in yourself, even accounting for opportunity cost. Expected earnings increase by over a million for getting your degree. That's a large reason why people are willing to pay so much.

>College is still the best investment you can make in yourself No it's not. Not without qualifiers. What if it costs $5M/year and the median income for graduates is 40k upon graduation? Clearly not worth it. That would utterly ruin your finances for the rest of your life. So there is some point where it becomes worth it. The question is where, which is going to be a little different for everyone. Is 240k for a libera…

> What if it costs $5M/year and the median income for graduates is 40k upon graduation?

Then it wouldn't be the best investment you can make in yourself. For now it still is. Yes, paying 240k to make more than a million more inflation adjusted dollars over the course of your career is worth it. Now it's probably not a great idea considering you can graduate at a much lower cost, but on the margin, yea, that's a good investment.

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#167

Incentive structures are important, but not the entire story. The article makes no attempt to examine where tuition revenue is actually being spent. Without that piece, I don't find their argument particularly convincing. The article asserts: > Close to 70% of college students attend using federal student loans, so schools would have no choice but to adjust their tuitions to match [the maximum federal loan], or risk…

>where is that money going?

One place is that it is used to replace reductions in government support.

"the single most important factor associated with tuition increases was decreasing revenue from government appropriations, with state appropriations making up the majority of such revenue.[1] (this is an old study, but I believe the pattern still exists, and is even more exacerbated)

Another seems to be that administrative costs are growing disproportionately at the same time that public money has been getting smaller. This seems to be aligned politically, so it may need to be taken with a grain of salt but I can give one anecdote.

When I went to college, I was sent to see the veterans representative. At that time it was just a single person who had those duties tasked on top of her "real" role. Now, it's common for colleges to have entire admin teams to recruit and help veteran students. On one hand, this can be great for the colleges and students; if managed well, those students bring in "free" government money. On the other, it's probably hard to calculate the true ROI of such a team; for example, it may be hard to know how many of those student-veterans would have attended regardless if there was a full team to support them or not. But all those admin teams, across all the different groups and bureaucracies add up.

[1]https://nces.ed.gov/pubs2002/2002157.pdf

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One strategy is to go to community college for your gen ed requirements, transfer those credits to a more prestigious university, then finish your degree there. The piece of paper will have the university's name on it, but you will have saved money in the process. You have to do some due diligence to figure out what credits you can transfer. You don't want to waste your time and money on a class that doesn't count. B…

That's more hacking the system than using the system as intended

That some community colleges focused on being 'transfer schools' was old hat when I was in school 20 years ago; there were established curriculums designed to meet the general ed requirements of UC and CSU. Since then, many states have developed programs where you can get guaranteed transfer admission to their state schools for year three and four.

It's a better way to do it anyway. Lower level courses at big schools tend to be giant lectures, but many of those are going to be higher level courses at community college. Would you rather take Calculus in a giant lecture hall or a small class room? Same with Physics and Chemistry (although those at least have lab sections that are usually size limited)

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#169

I think the cultural stance in the U.S. that to progress in life/elevate oneself/stigma against forgoing college is also a large part of it. I personally think that one policy that could have an outsized effect in solving this problem is establishing a max percentage of income that student loan repayment can be required to be for a maximum number of years (I'm pulling these numbers out of nowhere but just as an examp…

I'd like a variant on this:

X% of income *above the poverty line*, no time limit, disappears upon death. Administered through the IRS, it's a line on your tax return and thus automatically adjusted for income.

(And I'd do the same thing with child support--x% up to $y.)

Re: High tuition costs mostly stem from the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act 1993

#170
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A college graduate will earn $900,000 more than a non-college graduate over their lifetime. A male college graduate, on average. https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/research-summaries/education... "Men with bachelor's degrees earn approximately $900,000 more in median lifetime earnings than high school graduates. Women with bachelor's degrees earn $630,000 more. Men with graduate degrees earn $1.5 million more in media…

> Why not both? Because forgiving loans is a moral hazard. It signals to new college students that they can take out more debt and it signals to universities that they can raise tuition.

I'm not saying you hold this opinion, but policy-makers seem to have little issue with moral hazard when it comes to bailing out "too big to fail" corporations. I get the moral hazard argument, but if it's truly a first-principle it should probably be applied more consistently.
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