Food security and the coming storm • Hacker News Board

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#401

Post by usrn » Mon, May 30, 2022, 8:06 PM UTC

guerrilla wrote: post #390

usrn wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of those immigrants are likely from other European countries with similar cultures and backgrounds. If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland and then Everywhere has the same problem.

> The majority of those immigrants are likely from other European countries with similar cultures and backgrounds. Nope. Please stop guessing. Only 35.4% were born in Europe. It's no wonder you come to your terrible conclusions if you just make things up and don't bother to look up trivial facts. > If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland This is just racism. > Switzerland Why should any…

>> If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland

>This is just racism.

It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability.

>Confounding Sweden and Switzerland

Sorry, I'm an American. Everything in Northern/Western Europe that isn't France, Britain, or Germany kind of blends together. It shouldn't matter anyway though right?

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#402

Post by Viliam1234 » Mon, May 30, 2022, 8:08 PM UTC

guerrilla wrote: post #171

Viliam1234 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As much propaganda as we hear, Russia's still getting what it wants. Russia pulled out of most of the country the day after Zelensky announced they might not go in NATO after all. This is Russian propaganda. First, NATO does not accept new members while they are in the middle of a military conflict. And Russia is occupying parts of Ukraine since 2014. So it's not like Zelensky's words changed something; he just com…

> This is Russian propaganda. Oh are Zelensky and The Independent Russian propaganda now? [1] Sorry, I can't keep up with you people. What about The Hill and AP[2]? > Second, nope, Russia absolutely didn't get what Putin wants. You may want to read his essay "On the historical units of Russians and Ukrainians". He wants the entire Ukraine to become a part of Russia. So now you buy into Russian propaganda instead of p…

> So now you buy into Russian propaganda instead of political science. Interesting.

There is a difference between believing propaganda and drawing conclusions from the fact that the propaganda exists.

As an example, imagine that there is a guy called Hitler, who writes a book saying "Jews are trying to destroy the world, but I am going to save the world by destroying them". If you read the book and conclude "this Hitler guy is going to save the world", you are believing the propaganda. If you read the book and conclude "this Hitler guy seems to hate Jews", you are drawing a conclusion. In both cases you have read the book and came to a conclusion, but the process was quite different.

Similarly, if a guy called Putin writes a book saying "Ukrainians are not a real nation, they are actually a part of my nation and it's a shame that they have a separate country", then if you conclude "the Ukrainians are not a real nation", you are believing the propaganda, but if you conclude "this Putin guy will probably try to annex Ukraine", you are drawing a conclusion.

Anyway, it's not just the book, it's also the fact that Russian tanks were already approaching Kiev (before they ran out of gas, and were destroyed or stolen by tractors), the news articles celebrating the capture of Kiev that were written in advance and accidentally published, etc. A large part of reality would need to be different to make "actually, Putin never wanted to conquer Ukraine" a plausible hypothesis.

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#403

Post by IncRnd » Mon, May 30, 2022, 8:33 PM UTC

oneoff786 wrote: post #387

IncRnd wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That might be what you want to comment about, but that isn't what "the thread is about." The thread has been discussing a shortage of formula and the safety and efficacy of replacing formula with a different substance for babies to eat.

I mean your link. You seem to think that webmd article describes how to make baby formula. It does not. It describes how to transition your baby to solid foods once it is ready. They’re not the same thing. If you follow the recipes there for a young baby you will likely kill the baby.

>I mean your link. You seem to think that webmd article describes how to make baby formula.

I'm not sure what you saw, but I never posted a webmd link.

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#404

Post by guerrilla » Mon, May 30, 2022, 8:37 PM UTC

usrn wrote: post #401

guerrilla wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The majority of those immigrants are likely from other European countries with similar cultures and backgrounds. Nope. Please stop guessing. Only 35.4% were born in Europe. It's no wonder you come to your terrible conclusions if you just make things up and don't bother to look up trivial facts. > If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland This is just racism. > Switzerland Why should any…

>> If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland >This is just racism. It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability. >Confounding Sweden and Switzerland Sorry, I'm an American. Everything in Northern/Western Europe that isn't France, Britain,…

> It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability.

It really is because you're missing the part about where we all have massive immigration and don't have "political instability" (quite the opposite really.) Total first and second generation immigrants here are 25%. Every 16th person is a first generation immigrant originating from outside of Europe. We're still number 7 on the Human Development Index in the world (the US is at 18), and within the top 5 for standard of living. Our murder rate is 1.08, while yours is 4.96! What's this magical threshold that we need to pass in order to get the food riots? Where do you get these ideas?

You're not going to change your mind even a little after what I'm telling you?

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#405

Post by vkou » Mon, May 30, 2022, 8:42 PM UTC

rfrey wrote: post #333

vkou wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In theory, you are correct. In practice, hedging for increases in fuel prices means buying something like oil futures. Which requires you to be at terminal at some port city 6 months down the line to physically collect the oil/gasoline/whatever that you bought. And then store it for the months before you use it.

Why? Wouldn't a farmer just buy the futures contract (or an option on it), then liquidate and use the profit to offset the loss on the spot purchase? I was under the impression that hedgers never take delivery.

Hedges who sit in an office at Wall street never take delivery.

If you're a person who actually needs the future, you need to take delivery. This makes sense on an industrial mega-farm scale, but doesn't make sense at the private-farm scale.

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#406

Post by usrn » Mon, May 30, 2022, 9:30 PM UTC

guerrilla wrote: post #404

usrn wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> If you take in too many immigrants you'll just destabilize Switzerland >This is just racism. It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability. >Confounding Sweden and Switzerland Sorry, I'm an American. Everything in Northern/Western Europe that isn't France, Britain,…

> It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability. It really is because you're missing the part about where we all have massive immigration and don't have "political instability" (quite the opposite really.) Total first and second generation immigrants here are 25%. Eve…

If you're going to compare homicide and demographic statistics in the US then you should remember that:

1/10 black people here are first generation immigrants which is extremely destabilizing to their communities. Remember that these communities account for the majority of homicides here (according to the federal government.)

While 75% (really closer to 85%) of your population is native or White only ~60-50% of the US is now (depending on how you count.)

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#407

Post by ALittleLight » Mon, May 30, 2022, 9:37 PM UTC

oneoff786 wrote: post #397

ALittleLight wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

That applies to assertions of fact, not reasoned arguments. There is plenty of evidence that incorrectly produced baby formula is dangerous. There are many studies showing the narrow range of nutrition and form of the baby formula that is safe.

Yes, and the claim that there are no safe DIY formula instructions is an assertion of fact. The question of whether incorrectly produced formula could be dangerous was never at issue.

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#408

Post by guerrilla » Mon, May 30, 2022, 10:22 PM UTC

usrn wrote: post #406

guerrilla wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not in fact, it's well known that if the immigration rate is too high (and this limit gets lower the more incompatible the cultures and people are) in any country you get political instability. It really is because you're missing the part about where we all have massive immigration and don't have "political instability" (quite the opposite really.) Total first and second generation immigrants here are 25%. Eve…

If you're going to compare homicide and demographic statistics in the US then you should remember that: 1/10 black people here are first generation immigrants which is extremely destabilizing to their communities. Remember that these communities account for the majority of homicides here (according to the federal government.) While 75% (really closer to 85%) of your population is native or White only ~60-50% of the U…

So you're not going to answer any of my questions and drag up more debunked racist talking points?

Poor people commit murder. Black people in America are poor (because history but also because America is still extremely racist and won't lift a finger to make up for that history.)

> 1/10 black people here are first generation immigrants which is extremely destabilizing to their communities

You're not thinking this through. 1/3 of our non-European immigrants are first generation, so your racist theory would predict that we would have an even higher murder rate than you have.

Actually, only 2.8% of your population is native.

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#409

Post by geoduck14 » Mon, May 30, 2022, 11:48 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #383

geoduck14 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>you cannot safely use toddler formula as a replacement for infant formula. This needs to be repeated. Do not swap them. My wife and I were trying to help a family by buying them formula - and we bought the wrong age range. It makes a big difference. Don't do it. On a side note, we are going to donate the formula we can't use to a stranger. So. There's that.

I mean, that makes sense, but on the other hand, I'm pretty sure human breast milk doesn't change composition as a child ages. If it's possible to develop a formula that is "close to human breast milk as possible", the age range really shouldn't matter.

Actually, it changes a LOT over time. I'm a little removed from the breast feeding days, so I had to look it up. Here is a cool article [0].

I'll summarize some of the cool points. Breast milk changes to respond to 3 distinct ages of the baby. Newborn to 3ish days. 3ish days to 1 year. 1 year to "the end".

Milk changes to respond to growth spurts of your baby!

Milk changes to provide antibodies. Not covered in this article: it is hypothesized that kissing your baby can give the mom bacteria on the baby - and then the mom makes the antibodies for bacteria the baby was exposed to.

Milk changes throughout the day!

Milk changes in the middle of breast feeding

That's it. Those are the ones I enjoyed. Here is the link!!

[0] https://www.todaysparent.com/baby/breastfeeding/magical-ways...

Re: Food security and the coming storm

#410

Post by SkyPuncher » Tue, May 31, 2022, 12:41 AM UTC

artificialLimbs wrote: post #394

SkyPuncher wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 'there's just no viable alternative' by the media This isn't the media's job. Their recommendation is to talk with your doctor. This is realistically the only safe suggestion since all of the alternatives are bad. > Famine relief, missionary and other charities do have reliable and nutritious recipes for baby formula alternatives that can be made in bush conditions and over open fires in metal pots. Please, please,…

“…talk with your doctor. This is realistically the only safe suggestion since all of the alternatives are bad.“ What exactly do you think we did before baby formula even existed? Or doctors, for that matter? This absolute dependence on systems is disheartening. We need a drastic reconnection with nature.

> What exactly do you think we did before baby formula even existed?

Well, we breastfed.

Problem is that isn't actually a reliable solution since not all mothers produce milk at the quantities their child needs. This is particular true as a child grows, many mothers grow tired of breastfeeding and look to formula as an alternative. Problem is this deteriorates their milk production since the child is eating less breastmilk.

-----

The reality is this situation is primarily dangerous for mother's who cannot breastfeed or lack sufficient production - and require formula. There is no go, safe, reliable option because Option A (Breastmilk) is gone and Option B (Formula) is as well.

People keep acting like there _should_ be a backup to formula, without understanding that humans are the only animals on earth that have created an alternative to their naturally produced milk.