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Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

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Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#131

Post by guerrilla »

marcinzm wrote: post #55
guerrilla wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense, humans are no different than any other animals and survive best in equilibrium and always die out in cases of uncontrolled growth.

>Nonsense, humans are no different than any other animals and survive best in equilibrium and always die out in cases of uncontrolled growth. Yet left on their own they will uncontrollably grow like what happens with invasive species. Then they'll collapse. Repeat a few times and some type of equilibrium may happen for a while until something else breaks it. Animals have no magic "equilibrium" sense but rather the su…

> Animals have no magic "equilibrium" sense but rather the surviving ones have evolved to have an equilibrium with their environment.

There's nothing magic about persistence balance in nature. It happens in millions of ecosystems.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#132

Post by tinco »

piva00 wrote: post #109
javajosh wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Devil's advocate: the only reason the product is so nice is because the grubby handed business types could raise the money by promising MRR to the investors. Reverse devil's advocate: and this is why hacking is so essential, so that some of us get to have our cake (meticulously and expensively designed stuff) and eat it too (opt out of MRR). Although this does create a new kind of 1%, but its one based on merit so it…

> the only reason the product is so nice is because the grubby handed business types could raise the money by promising MRR to the investors. Bingo! It's just the next layer of business types because they dominate this fucking system... Yes, it is the system: shameful.

Did you see the price tag? This device is super cheap for what it is, same as inkjet printers are. It's easier to sell a $50 printer and recover your losses through ink, than it is to sell a $200 printer.

You could solve the "system" by regulating that companies are not allowed to sell products at a loss, but that would be unamerican.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#133

Post by prasadjoglekar »

low_tech_love wrote: post #113

Maybe this is an unpopular opinion, but if you buy a product because you like it and admire the design and engineering on it, isn't this type of hacking actually a disservice to the company who made it? I mean, I'm not saying this should never be explored (hacking is fun), but in a way you're cutting the resources from the company and potentially helping to bring it down. After all, a business is not made only on top…

Hacking is capitalism at it's best. If someone else can do the same thing faster/better/cheaper, then they should! No one owes your business anything - certainly not patronage for bad ideas.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#134

Post by amluto »

throwaway09223 wrote: post #58
tomrod wrote: post #14

I am, more and more, deliberately choosing boring technology. Knobs in the car and on appliances. No screen interfaces. Low-tech where possible. We just replaced our "high tech" Maytag dryer and its "advanced" feature set for a low tech SpeedQueen, the same dryers you find in most Laundromats. Why? Repairability. While we could _technically_ replace the burnt out fuse in the Maytag, it would take at least two hours f…

SpeedQueen owner here as well. Even more important than repairability is that the SpeedQueen actually cleans my clothes . In the 80s I remember coming home with mud caked on my clothes, shaking them off and throwing them in the washer. I'd even throw my muddy sneakers in the wash. If I try that with a modern low-water unit there's still dirt on them after a wash. The SpeedQueen will handle this kind of heavy soiling.…

What low-water unit are you comparing to?

Here’s Wirecutter doing an actual comparison:

https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/speed-queen-revie...

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#135

Post by actionablefiber »

javajosh wrote: post #75
Waterluvian wrote: post #69

Wow. So I'm watching the Techmoan review and it's just amazing. You've got this pretty awesome product.... up until you can clearly see the business types shoving their grubby hands in the way of UX and good engineering. Oh no no no. We can't just sell a product. We need recurring revenue. So we'll make DRM proprietary detergent pods that require electronics in each one. Ah, but people will reject that because they k…

Devil's advocate: the only reason the product is so nice is because the grubby handed business types could raise the money by promising MRR to the investors. Reverse devil's advocate: and this is why hacking is so essential, so that some of us get to have our cake (meticulously and expensively designed stuff) and eat it too (opt out of MRR). Although this does create a new kind of 1%, but its one based on merit so it…

> Although this does create a new kind of 1%, but its one based on merit so its okay?

I think about this a lot. There are so many ways that the people who can least afford to be fleeced are getting fleeced the most, while people with the right savvy and some spare time, who are more likely to be earning well, are also able to avoid a ton of unnecessary cost. It's kind of a double whammy on the poor and unskilled.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#136

Post by adrianN »

mgdlbp wrote: post #76
throwaway09223 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SpeedQueen owner here as well. Even more important than repairability is that the SpeedQueen actually cleans my clothes . In the 80s I remember coming home with mud caked on my clothes, shaking them off and throwing them in the washer. I'd even throw my muddy sneakers in the wash. If I try that with a modern low-water unit there's still dirt on them after a wash. The SpeedQueen will handle this kind of heavy soiling.…

This is about dishwashers, but I once read about regulation-enforced water/energy-saving cycles resulting in ineffective cleaning, which backfired, as people then got in the habit of always selecting the heaviest cycle or even re-adopted pre-rinsing. Searching for the concept now, I can only find this article: https://www.wsj.com/articles/make-dishwashers-that-clean-aga...

I choose the eco-mode setting and lie to the machine that it's only half-full and my dishes are still cleaned properly. This is a newish Bosch model.

I also choose the eco setting on my washing machine and wash at 30 degrees and my clothes become clean (but I don't roll around in mud very often). That's a cheap Beko model that is about 8 years old.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#137

Post by j-bos »

low_tech_love wrote: post #113

Maybe this is an unpopular opinion, but if you buy a product because you like it and admire the design and engineering on it, isn't this type of hacking actually a disservice to the company who made it? I mean, I'm not saying this should never be explored (hacking is fun), but in a way you're cutting the resources from the company and potentially helping to bring it down. After all, a business is not made only on top…

Just for fun:

Maybe this is a popular opinion, but if you sell a product because you want people to continue giving you money and freedom to make make money, isn't it a this type of DRMing actually a disservice to the guy who gave you money? After all person is not made only to prop up companies. Maybe their life requires not ballooning costs on brand name generics and is impoverished without them (especially if it's a family).

The idea of buying to transfer ownership in exchange for a good. Ownership implies responsibility for the single good purchased, not for the coalition of sellers who relinquished their claim in exchange for my wealth.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#138

Post by gambiting »

amluto wrote: post #129
mgdlbp wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about dishwashers, but I once read about regulation-enforced water/energy-saving cycles resulting in ineffective cleaning, which backfired, as people then got in the habit of always selecting the heaviest cycle or even re-adopted pre-rinsing. Searching for the concept now, I can only find this article: https://www.wsj.com/articles/make-dishwashers-that-clean-aga...

My “modern” (20-year-old, which is solidly modern by this standard) dishwasher cleans much better than I remember my childhood dishwasher cleaning. It also doesn’t melt plastic on the bottom rack, which is a fantastic feature. The main downside is it takes two hours, and I think my childhood dishwasher took one hour. My modern front load washer gets clothes clean. It also doesn’t severely abrade them. As I understand…

My new(2 years old) Bosch dishwasher cleans much better than any other dishwasher I used in my life. I'm like 60% sure that the buttons on the front don't actually do anything, because it cleans equally well in all modes, from ECO(50C) to Heavy Load(70C). Yeah the eco mode takes 3 hours by default, but press "Vario Speed" and is done in 1:05h with the exact same result.

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#139

Post by jitl »

dkurth wrote: post #108
mgdlbp wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about dishwashers, but I once read about regulation-enforced water/energy-saving cycles resulting in ineffective cleaning, which backfired, as people then got in the habit of always selecting the heaviest cycle or even re-adopted pre-rinsing. Searching for the concept now, I can only find this article: https://www.wsj.com/articles/make-dishwashers-that-clean-aga...

Exactly. We pre-rinse the dishes, get the water running hot before starting the machine, and choose the heavy cycle. Even so, the dishwasher barely cleans our dishes. And it's a Bosch, well reviewed by Consumer Reports when we got it! People in this thread are talking about the SpeedQueen washing machine. Is there something similar for dishwashers? I would pay good money for a dishwasher that actually cleaned my dish…

Are you using pre-wash detergent? My parents struggled with pampering their washer for 20 years, turns out a spoonful of detergent in the body of the washer gets the same performance as all the pre-rinse etc etc.

Video on the subject: https://youtu.be/_rBO8neWw04

Re: Bob Cassette Rewinder: Hacking Detergent DRM

#140

Post by kosma »

javajosh wrote: post #79

Am I the only one who looks at these projects with a combination of awe and apathy and jealousy? I do software, not hardware, and I like knowing how things work. When an expert in a different field glances at a PCB and identifies components, their purpose, by sight, and then rummages around a loose parts bin to go deeper, it dawns on me: this is someone's life. The same way I've been swimming in (application) softwar…

You just described my joy of doing hardware better than I would have been able to describe it myself. Thank you.
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