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I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

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Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#31

Post by benkwokcy »

nlnn wrote: post #26
irjustin wrote: post #8

Wow Will was such a part of my childhood watching Star Trek. Obviously, he didn't appear often but he was memorable simply because there were so few people as young as him on the show. Sad to hear this all around. This also brought back memories of me being required to play piano growing up. I hated piano, performing (recitals), playing in general. I was terrrribbleee (still am) and was put up in lessons for 12 years…

It's a tough one. If you discover a passion for something as an adult, you'll often wish your parents had pushed you into it as a kid. I feel this way about music, zero education as a kid, started late as an adult, but feel I'll never catch up. Though there's no way of knowing whether I'd have felt the same as a kid, or pushed back against it at the time.

You don't have to catch up. It doesn't matter how good you are, only if you are enjoying it.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#32

Post by chrischen »

irjustin wrote: post #8

Wow Will was such a part of my childhood watching Star Trek. Obviously, he didn't appear often but he was memorable simply because there were so few people as young as him on the show. Sad to hear this all around. This also brought back memories of me being required to play piano growing up. I hated piano, performing (recitals), playing in general. I was terrrribbleee (still am) and was put up in lessons for 12 years…

It’s very easy for the parents to manipulate the child into thinking it’s their own idea, whether through guilt or simply not knowing any better. The parents are in a much more powerful position psychologically and mentally. So even if you don’t force them beyond their immediate will you could be doing something negatively.

I think the best way to decide what’s too much is to think about whether or not the child will, 20 years from now, write a blog post shaming and exposing their abuse inflicted upon them.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#33

Post by wahern »

irjustin wrote: post #8

Wow Will was such a part of my childhood watching Star Trek. Obviously, he didn't appear often but he was memorable simply because there were so few people as young as him on the show. Sad to hear this all around. This also brought back memories of me being required to play piano growing up. I hated piano, performing (recitals), playing in general. I was terrrribbleee (still am) and was put up in lessons for 12 years…

> Music is a very "asian" or "chinese" thing to put your child through.

Asian culture simply adopted American and English culture in this regard. In the United States circa 1950s and 1960s it was very common for children to be taking piano lessons, and owning a piano was also relatively common. Both the lessons and the piano itself were important status symbols, and having both were considered markers of being middle-class. My mother's side was middle-class Irish-Catholic and she and all her siblings had to take lessons; they also grew up with a piano in the home. By contrast, my fathers side was working-class Polish-German and both pianos and piano lessons were well out of reach--the family cleaned the church on weekends for reduced Catholic school tuition. But I think all 4 of my paternal aunts did have pianos in their homes as adults. So most of my cousins (all maternal, most paternal) grew up with pianos in their homes, though their parents were much less strict about lessons.

My wife, who grew up in Malaysia, had the same experience as my mother. All of her grandparents were already middle-class (shop owners, professionals, etc), but old-world Chinese middle-class where status markers were making donations to religious and fraternal organizations or studying calligraphy. It was her parents generation that bought pianos and forced the kids to take lessons. And doing the same was important for both she and her brother. (I also appreciate the desire, it's just less of a parental priority for me.)

The practice may be a little stickier in Asian culture (both in Asia and Asian diaspora) as the piano slotted into similar, pre-existing social customs which may remain more durable, but I think the overall arc is basically the same, just shifted up one or two generations.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#34

Post by sosborn »

irrational wrote: post #22
manmal wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clarification: I‘m talking about self-actualization & leisure time here, not chores. > What is a healthy amount of pushing vs too much? There is no healthy amount of pushing, period. If you stop applying pressure, children will find their own thing, and that’s the best outcome for them. Just make sure they know the possibilities of what they could do. What would you have liked to do instead of learning piano? Did you…

That's not true. I never pushed my kids and now that they are adults they are angry with my for not pushing them. For example, "Why didn't you make us play sports?" Well, if you had told me you wanted to play sports I would have supported you, but you never said anything. It turns out that kids don't really know have the maturity to do things unless pushed or encouraged by parents. Who knew?

Is it that they weren’t pushed to do sports, or is it that they were never given the opportunity to try it?

IMO, my role as a parent is to expose my kids to as many things as I can. If the like it, I give them more, if they don’t, then we move on to something else.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#35

Post by irjustin »

benkwokcy wrote: post #31
nlnn wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a tough one. If you discover a passion for something as an adult, you'll often wish your parents had pushed you into it as a kid. I feel this way about music, zero education as a kid, started late as an adult, but feel I'll never catch up. Though there's no way of knowing whether I'd have felt the same as a kid, or pushed back against it at the time.

You don't have to catch up. It doesn't matter how good you are, only if you are enjoying it.

At the same time, I understand it. There are some things simply out of reach, music you literally cannot play because those wires weren't built when you were younger.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#36

Post by bscphil »

beebmam wrote: post #24
jay_kyburz wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a 10 and an 8 year old, and I don't agree that kids will find their own thing. I have to apply a fair amount of pressure to get 20 minutes of reading homework on school nights. I even have to apply some pressure to get them to put their laundry in the basket and put their clean clothes away. There are heaps of things that just aren't that fun but that are actually important.

As long as you keep your kids away from addictive things, like social media, cell phones, heavily processed foods, drugs, sex, etc, they'll probably figure things out all right. But it seems easier than ever to fall into cycles of addiction in this era, no matter where you live on earth. So I'd say pushing kids away from those things is necessary. Beyond that, I'm not so sure.

Yeah, I think this gets at something important. If the options are homework, reading a book, building something, or playing Fortnight, 90% of kids are going to pick the video game. If most of the time they only have the first three options, finding a better balance is going to be easier.

Forcing children to do one particular thing (above and beyond what is required to survive in this cruel world) is probably bad. Making sure the options they have to choose from are healthy, non-addictive, and engaging is probably necessary, though.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#37

Post by shkkmo »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #16
manmal wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clarification: I‘m talking about self-actualization & leisure time here, not chores. > What is a healthy amount of pushing vs too much? There is no healthy amount of pushing, period. If you stop applying pressure, children will find their own thing, and that’s the best outcome for them. Just make sure they know the possibilities of what they could do. What would you have liked to do instead of learning piano? Did you…

I have a 10 and an 8 year old, and I don't agree that kids will find their own thing. I have to apply a fair amount of pressure to get 20 minutes of reading homework on school nights. I even have to apply some pressure to get them to put their laundry in the basket and put their clean clothes away. There are heaps of things that just aren't that fun but that are actually important.

Chores and homework are a long way from forced hobbies and careers.

The question is about pushing your kids to do things you think they should like.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#38

Post by shkkmo »

divs1210 wrote: post #29

Off topic: Though Will is better known for his role in Star Trek, my favorite work of his is a low budget film from the 80’s called The Curse. It is an adaptation of HP Lovecraft’s Color Out of Space, and IMO it’s the best Lovecraft adaptation ever made. (trust me, I’ve seen a lot)

Will specifically calls out The Curse in the article:

> the physical and psychological abuse she witnessed firsthand when she made me and my sister do The Curse.

So you comment isn't so much off topic, but is a bit tone deaf.

Re: I was forced to be a child star. It was never my dream or my idea

#40

Post by jay_kyburz »

shkkmo wrote: post #37
jay_kyburz wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a 10 and an 8 year old, and I don't agree that kids will find their own thing. I have to apply a fair amount of pressure to get 20 minutes of reading homework on school nights. I even have to apply some pressure to get them to put their laundry in the basket and put their clean clothes away. There are heaps of things that just aren't that fun but that are actually important.

Chores and homework are a long way from forced hobbies and careers. The question is about pushing your kids to do things you think they should like.

It wasn't when the OP first posted the comment.
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