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Kids are far behind in school

theatlantic.com

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Re: Kids are far behind in school

#261

Post by sodality2 »

micromacrofoot wrote: post #4

Interesting that it can be quantified somewhat… but the suggested interventions (extra tutoring, summer school, longer days) are just not going to happen. That education is gone. If they happen anywhere, it’ll only be rich kids.

I disagree. Gifted programs exist and students in it receive more personal and one-on-one support. Personally I didn't pay for my gifted program (or my parents, of course) throughout the entirety of elementary and middle school. Only in high school did I have to pay for the extra exams, which was approximately $400 (I shoveled snow to pay for it).

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#262

Post by tfandango »

sodality2 wrote: post #250
tfandango wrote: post #182

My wife teaches 2nd grade in a public school. She has kids this year who had not been in school since kindergarten. It is difficult to cover such an achievement gap when other kids in the class are on level. It's worse yet when our state has outsourced federal pandemic education fund distribution to 3rd parties which allowed people to purchase Xboxes and TVs. And even worse yet as her district is focusing on putting…

What are your(/her) thoughts on gifted programs? I can say personally that gifted programs saved me from this fate of slogging through high school during these pandemic years. For some reason some gifted programs get dragged but having actual difficult assignments instead of just crap I can google, honestly 100% saved me from mediocrity.

She likes them. Her school has a really high quality GT ("gifted and talented") teacher. It is an honor to get into the program and allows kids the opportunity to do longer-term project type learning like you are talking about. This also gives her more time to focus on the kids that are struggling while not holding back the kids that are already exceeding expectations. In our experience though, it really depends on the teacher, I suppose that goes for all classes in all schools. You were lucky to have a good one it sounds like!

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#263

Post by nemo44x »

em-bee wrote: post #255
nemo44x wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The #1 factor in determining if a kid will have a desired outcome is if they have a mom and a dad present. It's really that simple. And that means parental involvement. It's sad one is labeled a racist or anti-feminist or w/e when you point this obvious fact out. ~70% of black kids are born to single mom's. That's a broken culture. White kids are at ~30% and rising and we see the same failure rates. That's a broken c…

but what to do about it? we can't just expect parents to get involved. nor does it help to just blame their kids performance on them. the focus really needs to be on a broader level. what changes to our society are needed so that families can thrive so that they can actually focus on the care of their kids? things like higher minimum wage, parental leave, easy access to insurance, etc. all the general needs everyone…

So you're saying it's everything else that's wrong. Not that we accept single motherhood as normal and OK?

That's what's wrong here. Rights without responsibility. Stop incentivizing single motherhood, for starters. Encourage men to stick around and for both parents to rely on each other. It feels like you're helping but you're not. You're encouraging futile behavior.

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#264

Post by rkk3 »

leksak wrote: post #218
rkk3 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or that employers in the future will note that they graduated later in life and thus pass them over for a different candidate? How would a potential employer know they were graduating college at 24 vs 22, and without knowing the reason for the difference why would they care. "I'm afraid we can't hire you at FAANG, it seems you had to repeat the first grade 15 years ago."

I was thinking more about graduating high school. At least in my country that is something you'd put on your resume. A FAANG probably wouldn't care either way, but a Fortune 500 might, and numerous other places of employment might also pick the person that graduated "on time" if most other things are equal between two candidates. _If_ they knew the reason it might matter less, but not all employers will take the time…

For college graduates in the US, high school is typically not something included on your resume. The only time it'd makes sense to include is if it's a flex, like if you went to Philips Academy or somewhere "special".

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#265

Post by micromacrofoot »

sodality2 wrote: post #261
micromacrofoot wrote: post #4

Interesting that it can be quantified somewhat… but the suggested interventions (extra tutoring, summer school, longer days) are just not going to happen. That education is gone. If they happen anywhere, it’ll only be rich kids.

I disagree. Gifted programs exist and students in it receive more personal and one-on-one support. Personally I didn't pay for my gifted program (or my parents, of course) throughout the entirety of elementary and middle school. Only in high school did I have to pay for the extra exams, which was approximately $400 (I shoveled snow to pay for it).

Kids from poorer households are much less likely to be in these programs. Of course plenty of individuals defy this, but from a broad sociological context mostly kids from wealthier educated backgrounds end up in "gifted" programs.

In the US household income is one of the most reliable ways to predict academic success. We're already seeing Covid widen some of these existing gaps.

This is also kind of irrelevant to the parent article. All kids lost out during the pandemic. Without additional efforts beyond what was happening pre-pandemic, everyone will slide down a little.

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#266

Post by AbrahamParangi »

prescriptivist wrote: post #224
Steltek wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to anecdotally back you up, in Massachusetts with the #1 public schools in the country, I hear and see nothing about football. I think I hear more about the HS plays and concerts than HS football. The last football funding discussion at the town level was whether to fund better helmets to protect against CTE or make the players' parents pay for it, so the town isn't seen supporting/encouraging brain damage to c…

I assume the #1 public schools in Massachusetts are Cambridge/Beacon Hill? There are many more reasons why they would be best in class than de-emphasizing football.

I went to an excellent suburban public high school (ranked 10th on this list https://www.bostonmagazine.com/education/best-public-high-sc...) and I can corroborate the parent comment.

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#267

Post by mort96 »

kurisufag wrote: post #216
mort96 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might have to do with the media enviroment we're exposed to; I'm from Norway, and I feel like the impact on children has been on the forefront of everyone's mind all the time, in domestic news, in domestic policy, and in my impression of international news. But the view from within the US might be completely different. One problem I've seemed to notice in the US is that you have the "somewhat reasonable" side and…

>you have the "batshit insane" side which claimed that masks literally deprived you of oxygen, and then the "somewhat reasonable" side would over-correct and downplay any negative sides to having to wear a mask this seems to be a false dichotomy. you can certainly fit all of the opinions into a binary if you'd like, but nowhere near enough people believed what you are calling "batshit insane" to constitute one side.…

You literally had the president suggesting that wearing surgical masks caused increased transmission and that drinking bleach might cure COVID. And the talking point about how it was no worse than a flu was extremely widespread in one part of the spectrum. It's obviously not a strict binary, but the insane ideas were common enough to talk about them as a "side".

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#268

Post by gokdisjtrdcvv5 »

annyeonghada wrote: post #228
Talinx wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm from Germany, here sport is integrated into the timetable like every other subject. Sport is not that important here so I might underestimate the amount/impact of sports in US high schools. I'd say that more sport is generally a good thing. What matters most to me about high school learning is that IQ does not decline. Grades are just a bad IQ test and most things you learn in high school don't matter. Sport is h…

>Grades are just a bad IQ test and most things you learn in high school don't matter. Well, speak for yourself. It may be a very unpopular opinion here on HN but I learned a lot at school, be it elementary, middle, high or university. But I went to school in Italy, and it was a good school. >But I think that for most people many things that are taught in high school are useless while more important things (understand…

Grades are not very accurate indicators of learned maternal.

4.0s only mean you worked really hard or, in very rare cases, are extremely intelligent. I know a guy who got a 3.2 in calc 3. Doesn’t sound very good right? Well the only reason is because his teacher was test heavy and those tests were quite difficult. My teacher was much more focused on homework so I could work harder to get a good grade. After working with him I realized we almost exactly the same amount. However, if you looked at our grades I would seem significantly “smarter” than him.

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#269

Post by xeromal »

lapcat wrote: post #157
brightball wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing about football is that so many people are involved with it, it becomes a school wide event. You have players on the team and coaches, yes. But you also have cheerleaders, marching band, trainer assistants (usually students who want to go into medicine or physical therapy). There are homecoming pagents and dances plus the social event every weekend for the school that goes along with it. There’s no sport in…

> There’s no sport in high school that comes close to pulling everybody together the same way as football. Wow, that's not my high school experience. Sports divided the student body into the popular athletic kids and the unpopular academic kids. If you celebrate the football team and not the math team, the results are predictable, and they won't be to promote math.

Everyone has unique experiences but growing up, some of the smartest kids I knew with athletes. Not sure if it was because sports can often force you to give your all in all ways (sports and education) or if wanting a better shot at a college team required they be diligent in their studies.

The top guy in my school ended up going to GA Tech on a baseball scholarship.

Re: Kids are far behind in school

#270

Post by Terry_Roll »

sodality2 wrote: post #241
annyeonghada wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Does each child have their own, adequately sized, room with a study desk to work in and concentrate? During the pandemic it turned out to be a real problem that children who had to share rooms had issues following streamed lectures. I had a small that I shared with two brothers. My desk was minuscule. I had top grades. >Do the children, particularly those of working age (14 and above, but especially 16 and above) ha…

Have you considered that your experience is entirely anecdotal and statistically someone in your place is less likely to succeed in general, not guaranteed to fail?

Did anyone get their exams paper's back and check the answer's against text books? If you didnt, how did you know your grade is accurate?

I was living in a four man tent during my exams, fortunately I had it to myself.

Not the best situation to be in but its made me hyper aware of how corrupt the criminals running the world are.

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