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The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

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Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#71

Post by delusional »

turbinerneiter wrote: post #29
fock wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thanks, now I've skimmed the verge piece and read your summary and have to admit: wasn't the main point of the verge that it's absolute ridiculous that the "apple approved"-way of fixing things requires two peli-cases of custom tools. This doesn't scale FOR THEM and one of the main points of criticisim in the verge revolved around that! The whole process is just designed so that in 3-4 years Apple will go to their fa…

The article made it seem like Apple is forcing anyone to get these tools, when they are not. The article heavily falls into the exactly that trap.

Excuse me what? Did we read the same article?

The conclusion of the article is literally:

>The more I think about it, the more I realize Apple’s Self-Service Repair program is the perfect way to make it look like the company supports right-to-repair policies without actually encouraging them at all. Apple can say it’s giving consumers access to everything, even the same tools its technicians use, while scaring them away with high prices, complexity, and the risk of losing a $1,200 deposit. This way, Apple gets credit for walking you through an 80-page repair, instead of building phones where — say — you don’t need to remove the phone’s most delicate components and two different types of security screws just to replace a battery.

> I don’t think Apple expects anyone to seriously take it up on the offer of self-service repair kits. It stacked the deck in favor of taking your phone to an Apple Store, where it can tempt you to buy something new instead. The real victory will come months or years down the road, though. That’s when Apple can tell legislators it tried to give right-to-repair advocates what they wanted — but that consumers overwhelmingly decided Apple knows best.

The whole tone of the article is clearly that it's absurd to rent these tools, and that the option to do so is a red herring.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#72

Post by delusional »

Nextgrid wrote: post #65
ksec wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

I wouldn't be surprised if making the tools available was indeed a PR move by Apple to show off how difficult & inconvenient a "perfect" repair is to do. They didn't have to do it and as far as I know nobody was asking for those (opening/closing iPhones is a long-solved problem by various third-party tools) - instead the RtR crowd is asking for parts and schematics (which this self-repair program doesn't fully addres…

It's crazy to read this comment because the article in the verge literally makes the exact same point.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#73

Post by gabrielblack »

I totally agree with Rossmann: the more important thing is that you can lease the equipment from Apple but there is no obligation. The equipment is intended to do a job compliant with Apple standard but, if you don't care to replace the water proof sealant, etc, you can use tools you already have or more cheap from your regular sources ( hardware stores, ebay, etc). The right to repair is a serious matter, without activist like Rossmann, who spent his time to speak to the US Congress, we wouldn't even have the spare parts from Apple: this is the real vantage, not the possibility to lease the tools.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#74

Post by Wowfunhappy »

delusional wrote: post #72
Nextgrid wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't be surprised if making the tools available was indeed a PR move by Apple to show off how difficult & inconvenient a "perfect" repair is to do. They didn't have to do it and as far as I know nobody was asking for those (opening/closing iPhones is a long-solved problem by various third-party tools) - instead the RtR crowd is asking for parts and schematics (which this self-repair program doesn't fully addres…

It's crazy to read this comment because the article in the verge literally makes the exact same point.

I partly agree, but I wish The Verge had been clearer that the huge kit was optional and the other parts could be bought separately.

And... I don't know, PR move or not, isn't it awesome that regular consumers can rent access to the full kit? I'm not sure who I'd recommend it to, but I'm sure someone is super excited, and good for them!

If I'd written the article at The Verge, I would have ended with something along the lines of:

> For most people, renting Apple's Tool Kit isn't worth the cost or hassle. If you don't have experience repairing electronics, the Apple Store is a safer and easier alternative, and if you do, you probably have your own tools already. It's great to see Apple selling genuine replacement parts to consumers. Just, don't throw out that iFixIt toolkit quite yet!

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#75

Post by HomeGear »

Nextgrid wrote: post #65
ksec wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

I wouldn't be surprised if making the tools available was indeed a PR move by Apple to show off how difficult & inconvenient a "perfect" repair is to do. They didn't have to do it and as far as I know nobody was asking for those (opening/closing iPhones is a long-solved problem by various third-party tools) - instead the RtR crowd is asking for parts and schematics (which this self-repair program doesn't fully addres…

While I have no data to support this, I don’t think “regular people” are purchasing OEM parts, renting tools for a $1,200 deposit, and risking self-repair. To me, the idea is almost absurd.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#76

Post by simonh »

delusional wrote: post #71
turbinerneiter wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article made it seem like Apple is forcing anyone to get these tools, when they are not. The article heavily falls into the exactly that trap.

Excuse me what? Did we read the same article? The conclusion of the article is literally: >The more I think about it, the more I realize Apple’s Self-Service Repair program is the perfect way to make it look like the company supports right-to-repair policies without actually encouraging them at all. Apple can say it’s giving consumers access to everything, even the same tools its technicians use, while scaring them a…

Or alternatively it was absurd for hobbyist repairers to ask for these tools in the first place, and if they’re upset now when they are given what they asked for, maybe that’s on them, not Apple.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#77

Post by the_only_law »

zamalek wrote: post #49
dvhh wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it was admitted that the editing made things worse than it already was

He did a follow up video with LTT explaining everything (while building a PC). He got the script on/near to the day and it made no sense to him either. He may have made some mistakes under the pressure, but Verge was to blame for 90% of that train wreck.

I’d be very listed and eager for some compensation. That guy was dragged pretty bad in many internet circles.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#78

Post by ClumsyPilot »

Nextgrid wrote: post #65
ksec wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

I wouldn't be surprised if making the tools available was indeed a PR move by Apple to show off how difficult & inconvenient a "perfect" repair is to do. They didn't have to do it and as far as I know nobody was asking for those (opening/closing iPhones is a long-solved problem by various third-party tools) - instead the RtR crowd is asking for parts and schematics (which this self-repair program doesn't fully addres…

> The fact that they're subsidizing the tool kits (the $1200 deposit they take is nowhere near the value of all that equipment)

That's not a subsidy - in the normal course of business the deposit is returned and no money changes hands.

The deposit is just an insentive to return the goods, it can cover 30% or 300% of the value. The tools might not be returned, and that probably is a crime, but that's not a subsidy.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#79

Post by crisdux »

runeks wrote: post #34
de6u99er wrote: post #8

Remember The Verge's PC build video? https://youtu.be/2lmfF0k2UcU

No. Why is it relevant?

It's relevant because people should consider the source when they perform an initial appraisal of a piece of information. The Verge is a vox media owned publication with low standards and lack of expertise on most topics they cover.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#80

Post by nabla9 »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #54
nabla9 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is something wrong in the other side. Whey you try to make a phone that is water tight, very tiny, tough and as durable as possible, you can't expect it to be easy and safe to open with easy tools. These tools are still cheap enough that you could have them in your local community center or library (here in Finland we have weird stuff in local libraries) where people can do it. Changing batteries to watertight…

Watches use a gasket and either a friction fit or screwed on cover. There is no reason a phone manufacturer can't do the same with a larger product.

You use case back press or similar tool to remove it if you don't want scratches. Just like with a iPhone you can always use knife if you don't care.
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