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The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

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Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#61

Post by nudgeee »

samsa wrote: post #43
ksec wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

Apple would like you to have them / their contractors repair your device, or better yet buy a new one. Everything about this program signals that Apple is grudgingly doing this. It's designed to scare people away from doing the repairs themselves.

The idea of OEM repairs is to get the product back as close to factory quality as possible with as little margin for error as possible by the operator. This often requires custom tools and jigs to maximize repeatability at a high quality standard, especially on something as complex and highly integrated as a smartphone.

The gripe of the right to repair movement isn’t that tech should be made less complex, it is that the access to parts, information and schematics/designs should be made more accessible for repairs — useful if you have the necessary skills required to carry out repairs without OEM tools.

This is coming from someone who does board level repairs on the side.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#62

Post by rvz »

goodguyamerikan wrote: post #15

I've said it before and I'll say it again-- verge is long form tabloid. They are deliberately contrarian (in the hope of appearing smart) and provocative (in the hope of getting eyeballs). Except polygon, the entire group of publications is pure sleaze.

> They are deliberately contrarian (in the hope of appearing smart) and provocative (in the hope of getting eyeballs).

Yes. It is no different to the Daily Mail as they deliberately have clickbait headlines that bring in outrage and have their brainless commenters regurgitating the same manufactured nonsense by the views of the editor; especially when not all of their articles enable the comments.

Rarely do you get someone calling them out for their inaccurate reporting in the contents of the article. If one highlights an inaccuracy, their army of muppets will scream at you for not having the same views as them or the editor.

They should just stick to tech reviews or buyers guides. Anything on politics, tech news, crypto, law-suits, etc steer clear from it.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#63

Post by Sebb767 »

samsa wrote: post #43
ksec wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

Apple would like you to have them / their contractors repair your device, or better yet buy a new one. Everything about this program signals that Apple is grudgingly doing this. It's designed to scare people away from doing the repairs themselves.

Honestly, how? They provide the parts at a reasonable price and even provide the actual tooling they use to get something as close to OEM repair as possible. There are a lot of things faulty at Apple, but this is not one of them.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#64

Post by [deleted] »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #54
nabla9 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is something wrong in the other side. Whey you try to make a phone that is water tight, very tiny, tough and as durable as possible, you can't expect it to be easy and safe to open with easy tools. These tools are still cheap enough that you could have them in your local community center or library (here in Finland we have weird stuff in local libraries) where people can do it. Changing batteries to watertight…

Watches use a gasket and either a friction fit or screwed on cover. There is no reason a phone manufacturer can't do the same with a larger product.

[deleted]

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#65

Post by Nextgrid »

ksec wrote: post #40
michaelnoguera wrote: post #16

I have tried to faithfully summarize the video here. If you notice a mistake or omission, please correct me. Rossmann’s main message: “to complain about something that is an option rather than complain about all of the options that are missing misses the forest for the trees”. Key points: 1. For certain repairs, Apple’s repair program has “made availiable the exact same OEM parts and tools that they use” via rental.…

Unpopular opinion. The Verge did exactly what Apple would have like them to do. And you could argue whether that was intentional or not. ( Part of the whole PR play is to shape public discourse ) By showcasing the proper way of doing it, or how it is done when you paid $69 in the Apple Store, the article has correctly set the stage for 99% of Tech readers. ( Non-Tech people never give a damn or wouldn't want to try i…

I wouldn't be surprised if making the tools available was indeed a PR move by Apple to show off how difficult & inconvenient a "perfect" repair is to do. They didn't have to do it and as far as I know nobody was asking for those (opening/closing iPhones is a long-solved problem by various third-party tools) - instead the RtR crowd is asking for parts and schematics (which this self-repair program doesn't fully address - the parts catalog is minimal).

The fact that they're subsidizing the tool kits (the $1200 deposit they take is nowhere near the value of all that equipment) also suggests that they wanted regular people to get their hands on these tools (and no doubt talk about it) as opposed to charging the actual market value which - while affordable for a repair shop - would've been way out of reach of a regular user.

After all, this kind of equipment is not new and has been available for ages (comments on another thread about this say that in China every phone repair outlet had similar equipment) if you could justify buying it, and yet we haven't had articles like this on major tech news websites until Apple subsidized it enough and put it in a nice, idiot-friendly package.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#66

Post by fartcannon »

nudgeee wrote: post #61
samsa wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple would like you to have them / their contractors repair your device, or better yet buy a new one. Everything about this program signals that Apple is grudgingly doing this. It's designed to scare people away from doing the repairs themselves.

The idea of OEM repairs is to get the product back as close to factory quality as possible with as little margin for error as possible by the operator. This often requires custom tools and jigs to maximize repeatability at a high quality standard, especially on something as complex and highly integrated as a smartphone. The gripe of the right to repair movement isn’t that tech should be made less complex, it is that…

Mostly I don't want to have to worry what booby traps might trip in a device I payed a substantial amount for because of some petulant CEO.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#67

Post by Bud »

nudgeee wrote: post #61
samsa wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple would like you to have them / their contractors repair your device, or better yet buy a new one. Everything about this program signals that Apple is grudgingly doing this. It's designed to scare people away from doing the repairs themselves.

The idea of OEM repairs is to get the product back as close to factory quality as possible with as little margin for error as possible by the operator. This often requires custom tools and jigs to maximize repeatability at a high quality standard, especially on something as complex and highly integrated as a smartphone. The gripe of the right to repair movement isn’t that tech should be made less complex, it is that…

This may be the gripe of your particular highly-skilled niche of the right-to-repair movement, but wide swaths of said movement are agitating for products to be wholly redesigned in the ways they prefer, to aid in much easier repairs. Never mind what the other 98% of the market might like.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#68

Post by makeitdouble »

omegabravo wrote: post #42
Ekaros wrote: post #25

I think issue is that they come from different view points. Rossman runs a company offering these services and he sees issues what they are allowed and can do about repairs. And he has essentially trained and skilled labour to do it. On other hand Verge look it from consumer standpoint. Who might do one of repair every few years. From that view devices should be much simpler and easier to repair by unskilled owners.…

How do you get ever thinner phones without the tooling designed to dismantle it? It's no different in other industries. Small and compact requires special tools. You (and I) being willing to compromise on size to have better ability to repair the device doesn't represent the market at all. These complex engineered systems are going to continue to trend towards costly tools for repair. In a similar way, ICs are also i…

> How do you get ever thinner phones without the tooling designed to dismantle it?

This all issue made me think about the SIM tray: the SIM card contacts could also be sealed and recessed between the battery and the motherboard, and you’d go to an Apple Store to change the card whenever you need it.

But you don’t, no one would accept having to get a phone serviced every time a SIM change is needed, even if some people never ever change it after purchase. So it’s designed in a way that you just push a thin bar in it and it pops out, you put your card, push it back, and your phone is still thin and waterproof.

I genuinely think Apple could come up with a similarily elegant solution if they were making way more money by having easy to repair phones than having people give up and buy new phones instead.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#69

Post by g051051 »

michaelnoguera wrote: post #16

I have tried to faithfully summarize the video here. If you notice a mistake or omission, please correct me. Rossmann’s main message: “to complain about something that is an option rather than complain about all of the options that are missing misses the forest for the trees”. Key points: 1. For certain repairs, Apple’s repair program has “made availiable the exact same OEM parts and tools that they use” via rental.…

Thanks for the summary. His choice to film this walking around with the camera rolling and pitching like a ship on the high seas made it unwatchable for me. I felt the same way about the article, the author seemed to try as hard as he could to find fault with the whole process.

Re: The Verge is so bad they have me defending Apple [video]

#70

Post by Bud »

op00to wrote: post #36
Fuhrer01 wrote: post #17

Louis is doing god's work in right to repair. Hope he succeeds. I wonder what Hunter Thompson would say about Verge today.

He wouldn’t care about it because The Verge has nothing to do with politics. What do you think he would say?

Thompson actually had quite diverse interests, ranging far abroad from politics.
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