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Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

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Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#171

Post by slashdev »

abeppu wrote: post #164
_fat_santa wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been following the situation and it's absolutely wild. It all stems from their Zero covid policy, they are the only country still perusing it, to the absolute detriment and destruction of everything else it seems. With how fast Omicron spreads, zero-covid is simply untenable these days but China is trying... The basic report is that people are starving. The government has provided food but the food situation is…

Everyone other than the Chinese government seems to agree that a zero covid policy isn't realistic anymore. And empirically, they haven't succeeded. But ... why is that the case? Why _doesn't_ an ultra-strict lockdown for this long prevent spread (and allow existing cases to resolve)? What are the remaining opportunities for it to spread? Throughout 2021, I had sort of told myself that most of the harms of the pandem…

I agree with you. I also thought we were screwed in the West precisely because we couldn't do the kind of strict lockdowns China initially did, which worked so well for them.

Things have changed. I would say because countries don't exist in a vacuum, it's not tenable to have a covid zero policy. You'll always get reinfected from outside. This is only more apparent as covid had become more infectious. Combined with effective vaccines and a less dangerous variant - the optimal strategy seems to be just getting on with life and adding restrictions only as needed to keep hospitals from being overwhelmed.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#172

Post by jader201 »

CalRobert wrote: post #158

I was hoping this was a story about walkable streets and great urban placemaking, terrible to see it's actually a sign of misery.

Not everyone in the world lives in a city, and for some folks, cars are a necessity.

Sure, for some folks in the city, moving towards a car-less world may be ideal, but it’s not practical for every single person on the planet.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#173

Post by ryantgtg »

defen wrote: post #156
LinuxBender wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some theories posited by this youtuber [1] that suggest this has little to do with covid. I am curious what others here familiar with living in China think about this. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZHiE96tWY4 [video]

Can you give us a quick summary for people who don't have 15 minutes to watch a video?

I didn’t watch. But from what a coworker tells me, China has an unemployment problem and in order to control unrest caused by it they are forcing everyone to stay inside.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#174

Post by soperj »

jader201 wrote: post #172
CalRobert wrote: post #158

I was hoping this was a story about walkable streets and great urban placemaking, terrible to see it's actually a sign of misery.

Not everyone in the world lives in a city, and for some folks, cars are a necessity. Sure, for some folks in the city, moving towards a car-less world may be ideal, but it’s not practical for every single person on the planet.

> Not everyone in the world lives in a city, and for some folks, cars are a necessity.

Humans have been around for hundreds of thousands of years. Cars have been around for a little over 100. It's not a necessity, it's nice to have.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#175

Post by twh270 »

gfodor wrote: post #146
_fat_santa wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been following the situation and it's absolutely wild. It all stems from their Zero covid policy, they are the only country still perusing it, to the absolute detriment and destruction of everything else it seems. With how fast Omicron spreads, zero-covid is simply untenable these days but China is trying... The basic report is that people are starving. The government has provided food but the food situation is…

The end result of Communism is always the same, but the details vary. It’s fundamentally fragile.

That would get you banned from 95% of Reddit subs. (Kidding, mostly..)

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#176

Post by whimsicalism »

bart_spoon wrote: post #163
whimsicalism wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reality aside, there are millions of people in China who are alive today who would not be if they had followed the US' policy. It is far too early to be calling that a failure.

You are assuming they are reporting actual death numbers instead of suppressing them, which is an assumption I don't know why anyone would make. https://www.forbes.com/sites/georgecalhoun/2022/01/02/beijin...

I don't doubt some deaths are underreported, but if they had seen anything close to the death rate & spread & hospital influx as in the US, it would have been obvious from outbound traveler antibody tests as well as just social media reports.

The Economist "model" your article relies on is seriously, seriously flawed. It is laughable to see it reported on as if it is ground truth. I highly encourage you to look into the details of how they get the numbers your article is citing.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#177

Post by jstrong »

xyzzy123 wrote: post #113
scarface74 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was very cautious before the vaccines. But afterwards, it was mostly Covid theatre in the US: 1. Mask mandates - dumb - people who didn’t want to wear them weren’t wearing them properly and most were wearing completely ineffective cloth masks. I travelled a lot and you were allowed to take your mask off while eating on a plane. So what good was requiring a mask? 2. Vaccine mandates - everyone agrees that the vaccin…

Re: the masks on planes. Assume a linear rate of virus particle shedding per breath and calculate the total viral load in the air of the plane over time, assuming the mask can catch a resonable proportion. The "pointless ceremony" of "masks while not eating" works out better. I think because we see ourselves as "sick or not sick" and "infected or not infected", people are not very calibrated to think or care about ma…

if masks work so well, why didn't they work? how did omicron get around the world in like two weeks flat when everyone was wearing masks on planes? at what point does covid making an utter mockery of our mitigation efforts start to dent your faith in them?

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#178

Post by hueyluey »

gfodor wrote: post #146
_fat_santa wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been following the situation and it's absolutely wild. It all stems from their Zero covid policy, they are the only country still perusing it, to the absolute detriment and destruction of everything else it seems. With how fast Omicron spreads, zero-covid is simply untenable these days but China is trying... The basic report is that people are starving. The government has provided food but the food situation is…

The end result of Communism is always the same, but the details vary. It’s fundamentally fragile.

Why do you think it's fundamentally fragile? The soviet union lasted for about 70 years. China has had a unique party for around 70 years (and no signs of ot changing anytime soon). What other types of government are less fragile? I think democracy is more fragile for sure.

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#179

Post by wvenable »

chamucoman wrote: post #138
electrondood wrote: post #134

How exactly is "zero-COVID" supposed to end? It seems like China are committed to extreme measures like this in perpetuity any time there is a future outbreak, which will happen.

The zero-Covid is just an excuse to manipulate the local (increasing wealth of citizens) and global (supply chain disruption) economic landscape. This should be obvious to anyone, but I guess is not, and some people still think this is about Covid.

How does disrupting the supply chain help anyone?

Re: Not a single car was sold in Shanghai last month

#180

Post by bowsamic »

abeppu wrote: post #164
_fat_santa wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been following the situation and it's absolutely wild. It all stems from their Zero covid policy, they are the only country still perusing it, to the absolute detriment and destruction of everything else it seems. With how fast Omicron spreads, zero-covid is simply untenable these days but China is trying... The basic report is that people are starving. The government has provided food but the food situation is…

Everyone other than the Chinese government seems to agree that a zero covid policy isn't realistic anymore. And empirically, they haven't succeeded. But ... why is that the case? Why _doesn't_ an ultra-strict lockdown for this long prevent spread (and allow existing cases to resolve)? What are the remaining opportunities for it to spread? Throughout 2021, I had sort of told myself that most of the harms of the pandem…

This is just a personal guess but I think it’s because omicron is just so infectious that it’s simply impossible to stop the spread
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