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Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

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Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#911

Post by HelloMcFly »

the_doctah wrote: post #602
HelloMcFly wrote: post #562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not, and it shouldn't be, and you should be ashamed of even thinking it. I didn't see the OP advocating for censorship, but for the enablement of moderation for unacceptable content within a community. Do you think LGBTQ spaces on reddit - for instance - should be prevented from banning users that compare them all to child molesters? Is that "censorship" that the OP should be ashamed of? Must all spaces be ent…

Your argument for "spaces" and "communities" goes out the window when moderators of subreddits are forced to make sure their space adheres to what Reddit wants. That's not your space, it's Reddit's. No one is stopping subreddits from moderating how they want, the problem is when they are forced to moderate how Reddit wants. Furthermore, your "communities" and "spaces" are nothing more than an excuse to create echo ch…

Forgive me, but I'm copy-pasting my comment from elsewhere.

----

I can't quite get a clear picture of what you actually believe. Come down to my level and talk specifics vs. generalities:

1) Do you think that individuals or communities creating a content-specific space for user interaction should not have any right or ability to moderate the content?

2) Do you think individuals or communities creating a space dedicated to specific interest, hobby, or lifestyle should have no ability to moderate that content?

3) Abstracting a level higher, should all space for user-generated conversation and content necessarily welcome all contributions? In other words, should everything goes, everywhere, in all communities where user interaction is invited? Or are you just arguing the point semantically?

I truly, sincerely understand the point you are making but I also have no idea what you're advocating for.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#912

Post by bonoboTP »

jasonladuke0311 wrote: post #733
dleslie wrote: post #714

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I currently have about a half-dozen accounts, each following different types of accounts with limited overlap. So, what I get on the genealogy account feed is limited almost entirely to genealogists and historians posting about those topics and very little else. People that stray too much get unfollowed. > And not everyone knows how to filter it, or they only have one account. Those are the most likely to leave. Yo…

> My experience is that _while engaging in that maintenance_ Twitter rapidly depleted in utility and value for me, because the dark patterns that encourage outrage engagement infected all those that I follow. It's simply not possible, AFAICT, to actively filter Twitter for strong content and not eventually either recede into accepting outrage or reducing one's feed to uselessness. I reached the same conclusion. It’s…

I also quit it and whenever someone links to it, I get a physiological reaction, like nauseousness and just have to close the tab. It's toxic fumes all over. Not possible to curate. I have blocked some words and mostly follow researchers but the controversial politics are shoved in my face. Everyone bending over backwards regarding Ukraine-Russia, some are still ranting about masks pro or contra, performatively being very concerned, some gender stuff, people at each other's throats regarding privilege and inclusivity, people bragging, humblebragging about their careers, self-claimed gurus telling their communities off, hot takes, then people complaining about too much bragging and calling out hustle culture and toxic positivity, others one upping these in some way or agreeing and fuming together. People only seeing other people as caricature stereotypes, like ah you must be a techbro, you must be an sjw, everyone assuming the worst, everything too serious and no lightheartedness.

It's pure monkey emotions and it brings out the worst of otherwise intelligent people. I've lost respect for several highly regarded scientists through this.

Twitter should just run itself into the ground.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#913

Post by antifa »

KerrAvon wrote: post #371
paganel wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That only works because HN is, mostly, politics-free. I'm not a regular Twitter user but afaik that platform is pretty heavy on politics, more than that, it's pretty heavy when it comes to a certain political spectrum, the other side has been mostly de-platformed by now. I don't consider that as a healthy platform to comment on for the general public (even though, I agree, it might be ok for people who happen to shar…

> has been mostly de-platformed by now Completely inaccurate. No one side has been deplatformed in aggregate. A few individuals have been suspended permanently for violating TOS. They should have been removed earlier, but were considered special cases due to their prominence. It amounts to Twitter removing its own inhibition on enforcing its TOS for certain prominent users. If you want a hard-right-wing heavy experie…

Who had been deplatformed that isn't objectively a terrible person and wasn't violating the ToS for a long time?

It's weird they would push such a dishonest narrative.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#914

Post by urthor »

brutus1213 wrote: post #658
throwaway_1928 wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Job offer or not, $42 million for doing almost nothing is a great deal.

I'm always curious .. how do these execs negotiate such contracts (where contingencies like getting acquired/fired lead to a payoff). Does this start at the VP or EVP level? I assume there are professionals/lawyers involved in the contract part (representing the exec I mean)?

It's simple.

You say "this company turns over 20 billion a year revenue. If I want to I can flush the whole damn lot down the toilet."

"Pay me to not do a shit job."

Latest in executive compensation research. As advocated by expensive consultancies.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#915

Post by bonoboTP »

ByteJockey wrote: post #834
vincvinc wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, are we on the same HN? I feel like I see a lot of topics debated I’d call political (“about how society ought to function”) on a daily basis.

> political (“about how society ought to function”) I feel like this is a technical definition of political, but that's not how the layman uses the word . I tend to hear the word political used as a synonym for the current arguments within a society, especially those that professional politicians feel the need to weigh in on and/or there is a significant chance of legislation around. So, for example, a passionate ess…

Right, it's an equivocation that often comes up, when people try to tell you that basically almost everything is political, ergo you are already allowing politics, ergo you must allow all politics, ergo I must be allowed to spew the generic mindless stuff on your platform too.

Orwell introduced the term duckspeak in 1984, and it best describes the way how people understand "politics". “Ultimately it was hoped to make articulate speech issue from the larynx without involving the higher brain centres at all.”

People usually don't have a problem discussing societal issues, most discussion topics somehow relate to how we live and work together and is political in that way, but more people have issues with the sort of partisan politics where the point is to score points against the "other team" over all else, painting the other side with vile adjectives, generalizing them, considering your own side as obviously, axiomatically good etc. You know it when you see it.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#916

Post by bonoboTP »

drewcon wrote: post #786
ilamont wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I also think the proposal to have Twitter allow all content that is "legal under US law" is a dangerous idea for the platform being a healthy community that most people actually want to participate in. This is key. If @dang suddenly threw up his hands and said "anything goes on HN within U.S. law" this wonderful virtual discussion forum would die and most of us would sign off forever. I say that as someone whose be…

I also have a reasonable expectation that HK is FOCUSED and CIVIL. I do not have that expectation on Twitter. Twitter is just a raw society fire hose and I'm fine with that. I think the future is to give SUPER clear power to individuals to manage their own experience. Freedom of speech is both the right to speak, but also the right of the listener to hear (or not hear) as an individual. I would also love to see twitt…

> I think the future is to give SUPER clear power to individuals to manage their own experience. Freedom of speech is both the right to speak, but also the right of the listener to hear (or not hear) as an individual.

That's the road to filter bubbles and radicalization because people never realize how obnoxious they are to real society. You can always find a few hundred other extreme fringe and deranged people from all over the Internet, while if you tried saying that stuff in real life, your community would slap some sense back into you. Online you can just block and move on and never face consequences, so you develop this righteous attitude that you know it all and you get validated by other loners from all over the world.

I think the only good way forward can be a return to physical spaces. People will realize this more and more and there will be some sort of hybrid approach. Actual real life communities are important.

Sure, niche hobbies may not sustain a large enough community in each little town, but do we really need to specialize so much? Does that really improve our affairs? Couldn't people compromise and get into some slightly different but still adjacent hobby?

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#917

Post by prmoustache »

senko wrote: post #901
prmoustache wrote: post #890

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tesla dragged the rest of the auto industry, kicking and screaming, into the EV business. I would say that the advance in battery technology, the laws introduced by state of California and north european countries did more than Tesla ever did. Also the Renault Zoe, still top selling EV cars in europe, had her first concept car showed in 2005 and was on sale only 5 months after the Model S in 2012. The Leaf also pre…

Zoe was a concept car, as was VW eUp. At the time, established car companies were doing concepts that looked like golf-carts and taking about "e-mobility". Look at i-Miev and the Roadster and tell me which one do you think a typical car lover would love more. If you think that would've taken over the car market .. then you're definitely not in the same circles I am :-) Other car makers started paying serious attentio…

The first Zoe was a concept car, the second one was a production model and it didn't popup from anywhere. It has been the most sold EV in europe for many years already.

>Look at i-Miev and the Roadster and tell me which one do you think a typical car lover would love more. If you think that would've taken over the car market .. then you're definitely not in the same circles I am :-)

The car industry do not care what the typical car lover love more. They have been a dying breed for more than 3 decades. The i-Miev and derivated counterpart sold 12 times more than the roadster because they are actually usable things and not enthusiast toys. It even outsold the Model-S in all the other markets than USA when they were both available.

The Model-S,X,3 and Y success came much later. The automotive industry definitely had a more cautious approach in the upper end segment but they weren't sleeping.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#918

Post by themitigating »

fleddr wrote: post #492
themitigating wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would they control mob mentality?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31160916 See above comment thread from another discussion, first reply is from me.

That's a decent plan. I like how you mention punishing false reports, I wish reputation had more value on social networks though they would have to protect against bots that boost it.

Couple of questions:

1.Normally when you report something as a violation of the rule and the moderators determine it is not a violation that might not be objective. "Hate Speech" for example is not objective even if you provide examples.

- How would you prevent people from being punished unfairly.

- Right now a false report has no consequences. Wouldn't reporting go down since people would want to avoid a punishment?

2. In detecting mob patterns how would you determine if it's not just everyone getting on to tweet about a current event and if you rate limit it doesn't that mean some people would be censored and others not simply based on time?

3. Related to the other limits you mentioned, such as number of retweets. What prevents people from opening multiple accounts or bots?

4. Assume the above three are solved wouldn't this put the business at a disadvantage due to both decreased ad revenue and competitors who don't have these rules?

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#919

Post by ramoz »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #637
kyledrake wrote: post #189

I've been using Twitter since it's main novelty was that it was a successful Ruby on Rails app, and honestly I've been trying to figure out where the exit is for my personal use of Twitter lately. If the acquisition goes through, Twitter won't make enough money to service it's debt, and the things they will do to fix that are pretty much guaranteed to lower the quality of the platform, which frankly has never worked…

It's interesting that a lot of people who are on twitter just don't like twitter already as it is. I imagine that's only going to get worse under a "no moderation" regime. I'd been wanting off of twitter for quite some time now as I'm pretty sure it was negatively impacting my mental health. Just this past weekend I decided to pull the trigger and commit twittercide - it's interesting how hard it is to push that 'dea…

Parent, Child, comments want off Twitter.

Interesting how some of you make it sound like a drug.

I deleted Twitter just fine over Covid period.

Re: Twitter CEO fires two top executives, freezes hiring

#920

Post by ramoz »

seydor wrote: post #343
kyledrake wrote: post #189

I've been using Twitter since it's main novelty was that it was a successful Ruby on Rails app, and honestly I've been trying to figure out where the exit is for my personal use of Twitter lately. If the acquisition goes through, Twitter won't make enough money to service it's debt, and the things they will do to fix that are pretty much guaranteed to lower the quality of the platform, which frankly has never worked…

Does twitter have a community? My use case for it is that of an RSS reader. I thought reddit was for community

Yes, manufactured influencers and echo chambers.
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