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No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

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Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YouTube is not a natural monopoly, as evidenced by the fact that there are other video hosting services (e.g. Vimeo, Facebook, PeerTube). The network effect is real, to be sure, but it isn't absolute, and anyone can start a competing service which is immediately accessible to every Internet user(†). It's not cheap or easy, of course, especially at YouTube's scale, but YouTube has to overcome the same issues. That's j…

> YouTube is not a natural monopoly, as evidenced by the fact that there are other video hosting services (e.g. Vimeo, Facebook, PeerTube). Tesla sells solar roofs and power walls accessible to every person in US. Is it an evidence electrical grid is not a natural monopoly? No it is not. Wikipedia defines natural monopoly as following: > an industry in which high infrastructural costs and other barriers to entry rela…

> Tesla sells solar roofs and power walls accessible to every person in US. Is it an evidence electrical grid is not a natural monopoly? No it is not.

Unlike competing video hosting platforms, solar roofs and PowerWalls are not the same product as the electrical grid. There is some substitution effect, but they generally work in tandem. Most solar and PowerWall-equipped homes are not fully off-grid; it can be done but it takes a lot of storage to ensure you never run out of power with normal household use. (My 5.12 kWh of solar panels generally result in a net surplus of energy each month, but even so I've calculated based on daily net consumption over the last ~16 months that 100 kWh of storage—7-8 PowerWall 2s–would still leave the system depleted by the end of the day 13% of the time. Granted, that includes a three-week span last February where the panels weren't generating much of anything due to snow cover, but that wasn't the only occasion where it would have run out.)

The "natural monopoly" of the electrical grid, for those who believe in such things, lies in access to the physical right-of-way for laying cables to everyone's houses. I'm not sure I'd call this a natural monopoly as the difficulty newcomers face in accessing the right of way (or depending on how you look at it, the ease with which the incumbents claimed the right-of-way for themselves, often through eminent domain) is mostly artificial. Regardless, while it is a true barrier to entry favoring incumbents over the competition, nothing of this nature applies to either Tesla's solar + storage business or to YouTube.

> The network effect does give Google that overwhelming advantage over potential competitors.

The network effect is certainly an advantage while it lasts, but networks are highly mutable, to the point that I wouldn't call this a barrier to entry. For example MySpace had major network effects once as the dominant social network—right up until it was completely replaced by Facebook. Crowds can be fickle like that. There isn't even a social network effect for YouTube like there is with Facebook, where you're strongly incentivized to stick with the same system your friends are using. If you upload your videos somewhere else—as many people do—everyone will still be able to see them.

Of course that doesn't guarantee that any particular experiment in competition will succeed. As you say, Google Video failed to gain traction, and it was hardly the only one. But even so, YouTube has competitors. The failure of Google Video does not imply that YouTube's position in the market is inviolable. They retain their place only so long as they continue to provide the best service.

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#442
post #156

I don't think it should be a surprise that as Youtube hired more and more experienced hands from cable and broadcast TV that it would progressively become more and more like TV. People complain about the manipulative algorithms. But they don't exist in a vacuum, they are the results of some execs deciding to manipulate people. And the way those decisions are made is the same way traditional TV made during all those y…

Hmm. Has YouTube been in the news for hiring broadcast execs? As somebody who is connected to broadcast, that doesn’t seem right to me - broadcast TV tends to be very control-freak-ish and the higher ups LOVE data, and I really doubt a broadcast exec would willingly chuck out an audience measurement datapoint. The broadcast ad model is that you create shows that have big audiences so you get lots of ad impressions. T…

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Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#443
post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see a Business opportunity for a new YouTube specific search engine, that will allow for discovery of new content but will filter all that crap:-)

What feedback mechanism would you use to filter the crap? There is no longer an incentive for users to down-vote (assuming you managed to even get that data). And such a search engine needs a literal army of users providing signal to evaluate the quality of content as it is released.

> There is no longer an incentive for users to down-vote

I don't get that. It should have the exact same incentive to down-vote, unless you think Google no longer collects or uses that information as opposed to just hiding it.

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#444
post #200
post #105

I've recently heard about this YouTube account named Roel Van De Paar. If you've looked up any error message on YouTube recently, you've probably run into him. Because of the "no dislikes" change, he's everywhere now. And by everywhere, I mean EVERYWHERE. The account has over 2 million videos. Approximately 0.2% of ALL videos on the ENTIRE platform of YouTube can be attributed to this account, and if you check now th…

Obviously, the guy is just ripping StackOverflow. His "latest" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtqJq0OF8eA Is a poorly generated copy/paste of: https://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/questions/1644... Probably a tiny Python script. Google is prompt to ban other accounts, hope some Googlers around here can can do something...

Stackexchange answers are creative commons share-alike by attribution, so as long as he would give attribution he'd be in the clear.

https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/347758/creative-com...

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#445
post #184

The only explanation for getting rid of dislike count that makes sense to me is to make big brands happy as their videos can't be made to look bad with a high dislike count and they can't be "dislike bombed" for things that may be unrelated to the content (eg the recent Activision-Blizzard scandals). Why? Because in every other way (and every way for the viewer), this makes Youtube worse. So it's a hell of a price to…

> The only explanation for getting rid of dislike count that makes sense to me is to make big brands happy as their videos can't be made to look bad with a high dislike count and they can't be "dislike bombed"

It was already possible before November 2021 to turn off the publicly visible like/dislike count on any video (getting essentially what we have now) and many big brands did exactly that.

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> YouTube is not a natural monopoly, as evidenced by the fact that there are other video hosting services (e.g. Vimeo, Facebook, PeerTube). Tesla sells solar roofs and power walls accessible to every person in US. Is it an evidence electrical grid is not a natural monopoly? No it is not. Wikipedia defines natural monopoly as following: > an industry in which high infrastructural costs and other barriers to entry rela…

> Tesla sells solar roofs and power walls accessible to every person in US. Is it an evidence electrical grid is not a natural monopoly? No it is not. Unlike competing video hosting platforms, solar roofs and PowerWalls are not the same product as the electrical grid. There is some substitution effect, but they generally work in tandem. Most solar and PowerWall-equipped homes are not fully off-grid; it can be done bu…

As you correctly pointed out, the natural monopoly of electrical grid is the network of the cables which connect large pool of producers to even larger pool of consumers. There’re many ways to generate electricity, but if one wants reliable power for reasonable price, the best way by far is connecting to the grid.

Similarly, the natural monopoly of youtube is the social network of people, which connects content creators and viewers. Now in 2022 it’s relatively easy to host videos even at scale, but if a content creator wants access to the global audience, or a viewer wants to watch videos, the best way by far is YouTube.

> networks are highly mutable

Facebook did not win as a result of services competing for users. Few people actually switched from myspace to Facebook. The way Facebook won, it managed to grow faster.

Facebook has 3B monthly active users. We have 8B people living on the planet, 5B of them are already using internet. In 2009 when Facebook overtook Myspace, only 1.8B people were using the internet. Facebook and youtube simply managed to capture the majority of these new 3.2B internet users, and that growth is what made these social networks so mutable in the past. This won’t happen again, not enough people on the planet.

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#448
post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I think you get zero information from someone who only upvotes or only downvotes, whereas you get some signal from people in the center.

Counterpoint: highly partisan voters who upvote anything from their team and downvote anything from the other, regardless of quality.

Accepted.

Re: No Dislikes has officially ruined YouTube for me

#450
post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2 million videos. Approximately 0.2% of ALL videos on the ENTIRE platform of YouTube Yeah I mean there's no way that's even close to accurate. You think there are only a billion videos on YouTube?

I can't find any reputable source or even credible estimate about the total number of videos on YouTube. What I did find, though, is that YouTube currently touts[1] "500+ hours of content uploaded every minute", which means 43.2 million minutes of video per day if we take that claim at face value. And a study finding the average video length was 11.7 minutes[2] in 2018. So, naively doing the math suggests that YouTub…

Fair enough - I literally just googled "how many videos on youtube" and stuck with the first result. Not very scientific but I also don't really care that much
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