Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 180 posts

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#101

Post by 14 »

herodoturtle wrote: post #91
palisade wrote: post #82

I worked at a place once where we got a memo that asked everyone to stop clipping nails and farting because the microphones installed in our desks were picking these noises up. The memo even added that if you need to fart please go to the bathroom. It wasn't a joke email, they were serious. Oh, also not many people realize this but CCTV cameras all have the capability to convey audio captured via an internal micropho…

One of the greatest benefits of working from home - which is seldom celebrated - is the ability to fart at one’s leisure without having to try silence it.

Well in 2019 you coughed to conceal a fart, in 2022 you fart to conceal a cough.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#102

Post by rubyist5eva »

palisade wrote: post #92
herodoturtle wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the greatest benefits of working from home - which is seldom celebrated - is the ability to fart at one’s leisure without having to try silence it.

We need a new law. The Freedom To Have Our Farts Go UnHeard Act. ;D

No no no, the name of it needs to be an acronym as well.

The Freedom-to Always Rip True Act.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#103

Post by palisade »

t-writescode wrote: post #98
palisade wrote: post #82

I worked at a place once where we got a memo that asked everyone to stop clipping nails and farting because the microphones installed in our desks were picking these noises up. The memo even added that if you need to fart please go to the bathroom. It wasn't a joke email, they were serious. Oh, also not many people realize this but CCTV cameras all have the capability to convey audio captured via an internal micropho…

I’m not a lawyer, but that sounds like such a violation of wiretapping laws. I don’t know of any zero-party consent laws for audio.

The legalese and marketing terms CCTV companies use to describe audio capture is, "situational awareness"

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#104

Post by pmoriarty »

bwestergard wrote: post #95
pmoriarty wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

INAL, but it seems that the wording in the agreement leaves open the use of surveillance software on employees, as long as it's not for the purpose of "evaluating the employee's work product (i.e. job duties assigned to the employee), the time an employee took to complete their work, or disciplining an employee in protected concerted activity." The company could still use such software on employees and claim it was d…

You are right that the language could be stronger. This was the outcome after a few rounds of proposals and counter-proposals. I believe that in the context of an overall agreement with a "just cause" provision, which we have tentative agreement on, we don't have to worry about "bossware" at all. > The company could still use such software on employees and claim it was doing so for security purposes, for instance, or…

"Our employer could not use information gleaned through software surveillance to demonstrate just cause, much as police officers can't introduce evidence obtained illegally in court."

Interesting that you should mention this, as police have been known to use "parallel construction"[1] to get around such attempts to restrict what they're allowed to do.

If companies can still surveil their employees, they might also resort to something like parallel construction to come up with other excuses to discipline/terminate their employees, even when the real reason they did so was a result of surveillance.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_construction

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#105

Post by giraffe_lady »

nixpulvis wrote: post #49

Security cameras at work are debatably legal under many states eavesdropping laws as I interpret the text. Of course INAL, and many places have better reason to have cameras, e.g. to curb shoplifting, but a corporate office really isn't one of those places. What am I going to do, steal some paperclips?

Even in those states it's only illegal if you're not aware or don't consent. Very easy to add a "you consent to our surveillance" clause to your contract. Pretty good odds a lot of us have them in there already if we read carefully.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#106

Post by palisade »

t-writescode wrote: post #98
palisade wrote: post #82

I worked at a place once where we got a memo that asked everyone to stop clipping nails and farting because the microphones installed in our desks were picking these noises up. The memo even added that if you need to fart please go to the bathroom. It wasn't a joke email, they were serious. Oh, also not many people realize this but CCTV cameras all have the capability to convey audio captured via an internal micropho…

I’m not a lawyer, but that sounds like such a violation of wiretapping laws. I don’t know of any zero-party consent laws for audio.

It's not all bad, though. Sometimes it's used for good like the gunshot direction detection mics.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#107

Post by aa-jv »

I recently had a manager insist that I install some MDM-like software on my laptop so that it could be tracked and managed remotely.

I said, "okay I'll do that, but then I'm never going to put that laptop on my home network, or use it on any network I may frequent outside of the office, so I'll just leave my laptop on my work desk instead". The point, of course, is the same reasoning behind IT policies that don't let people install stuff on work computers: if you're going to access my computer remotely, I won't trust it one single bit, so it doesn't belong on my home network.

This changed their mind, quick. All it took was a little resistance and "good for the goose and the gander" mindset, and the manager droid 'got it'. No, I won't be letting you spy on my family ..

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#108

Post by hajhatten »

aa-jv wrote: post #107

I recently had a manager insist that I install some MDM-like software on my laptop so that it could be tracked and managed remotely. I said, "okay I'll do that, but then I'm never going to put that laptop on my home network, or use it on any network I may frequent outside of the office, so I'll just leave my laptop on my work desk instead". The point, of course, is the same reasoning behind IT policies that don't let…

I simply uninstalled ours. IT couldn't understand why. Very thankful I have an understanding manager.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#109

Post by giraffe_lady »

SethMurphy wrote: post #85
hutzlibu wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you want to place cameras in your apartment in the first place? Maybe one camera for the entrance, if you have reasons to be paranoid (I was thinking about it for myself, because of weird landlord with second keys), but why more cameras? edit: one further reason for myself I remembered, watching the small kids from the smartphone, while going out for some minutes. But in the end I never set it up

1. Security I live in a leased ground level floor through apartment with three entrances not including 6 accessible windows. In order to cover an entrance from inside some of the living space would need to be included. To fully cover I would need 5 cameras and have them in bedrooms too. Exterior cameras could help, but I have no authority to install. While I have no specific reason to worry, I wouldn't want my landlo…

None of these seem actionable to me. What are you trying to prevent that a camera would stop? If the basement is visibly flooding then it is flooded. If someone is on camera entering your home then they are in it.

What are you going to do about it at that point that you wouldn't be able to do about it the next morning or whatever? Insurance doesn't require camera footage and realistically the most likely outcome of any of this stuff is an insurance claim.

The kids thing I don't know, it certainly depends on your family's circumstances and your personal concerns with your children, who you know and I don't. There are definitely situations where a camera can be worth it there, but not as many as most contemporary wealthy parents seem to think.

Re: Welcome to the era of the hyper-surveilled office

#110

Post by MerelyMortal »

frankfrankfrank wrote: post #99
pluc wrote: post #88

Get this. I worked for the company that produces most of the porn on the Internet. You know, the porn you can go to any torrent site and download for free within 10 minutes (and that statement has been true for as long as there has been an Internet and BitTorrent). That company periodically took screenshots of all (ALL!) their employees' workstations. They monitor internal network for suspicious traffic and, until CO…

You have to understand the primary purpose of that whole industry, which is not what most people think, in order to answer the question about what they were “afraid of”. Let me just put it this way, you are correct that the concern with employee monitoring makes absolutely no sense, because that’s not the right perspective, assumption of motivation.

What are you trying to say?
Post reply on HN