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Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

talmudology.com

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Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#121

Post by mensetmanusman »

unmole wrote: post #107
mensetmanusman wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you get offended by is an excellent source of introspection. I have worked with teens of the wealthy elite who are offended if one asks them to do chores (some call it abuse). Our current culture glorifies victimhood, so people are more attuned to being offended.

How would you like to be referred to as a barbarian, a kaffir or a mleccha?

I would not care, especially if it is over the Internet.

Not everyone has adjusted their priors on what it means for global dialogue, especially in the framework where there will always be someone in the world that will take offense to almost everything one says.

I more just feel sorry for these people, as most of them are dealing with other pain and stress in life, and they lash out irrationally like this.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#122

Post by aaron695 »

AaronFriel wrote: post #113
AaronFriel wrote: post #60

Whenever one finds an absurd "rule", there is, generally, a reason. You don't put up a sign that says "Don't stick utensils in electrical sockets" until someone's done it or thought about it. And if the rule is "don't juggle forks while riding a unicycle around electrical outlets", it's usually because someone lied about what happened. > Rabba said: One who fell from a roof and was inserted into a woman due to the fo…

It is revolting to me that people are replying to me with "let's not get too hasty, what if the woman wanted him to fall from the roof and become 'inserted' into her."

No post body was provided.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#123

Post by hash07e »

bradrn wrote: post #92
hash07e wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Upon searching for a few words here, this list appears to have been copy-pasted between a bunch of antisemitic sites. It looks like ‘Hadarine’ isn’t even a real book — the only results are for very similar lists on the aforementioned antisemitic sites. There are also problems in translation: e.g. ‘filth’ is a highly misleading translation of niddah . Besides, this cherry-picked list leaves out any relevant context, w…

No post body was provided.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#124

Post by bradrn »

hash07e wrote: post #123
bradrn wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Upon searching for a few words here, this list appears to have been copy-pasted between a bunch of antisemitic sites. It looks like ‘Hadarine’ isn’t even a real book — the only results are for very similar lists on the aforementioned antisemitic sites. There are also problems in translation: e.g. ‘filth’ is a highly misleading translation of niddah . Besides, this cherry-picked list leaves out any relevant context, w…

Quoted post unavailable.

> So several sages together came to these cherry picked conclusions.

To clarify my post: I meant that out of the thousands of thousands of opinions recorded in the Talmud, that list selectively quoted five or six phrases which make it sound especially bad when taken out of context, while ignoring absolutely everything else. That’s what I meant by ‘cherry picked’.

(Your other responses, especially the last few lines, are fairly common misunderstandings of Judaism and Jewish history, and I have neither the time nor the inclination to try and debate them online just right now.)

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#125

Post by gatlin »

bradrn wrote: post #93
AaronFriel wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a story of a rape occurring by an absurd sequence of events. The Talmud concludes that the rape isn't the punishable offense, it's only whether the man injured the woman when he fell on her from the roof. Anyone who uses this excuse will obviously not have "fallen on her", and therefore if she has any injuries it's almost certainly due to the violent rape occurring. The Talmud rules this out as being intentio…

> The Talmud concludes that the rape isn't the punishable offense, it's only whether the man injured the woman when he fell on her from the roof. Anyone who uses this excuse will obviously not have "fallen on her", and therefore if she has any injuries it's almost certainly due to the violent rape occurring. The Talmud rules this out as being intentional, and gives an excuse for would have rapists. Let me be clear he…

> In fact, it is so obviously implausible that no-one would dare use this situation as an excuse, and if they did, the only possible conclusion is that they were lying. The Talmud does not condone this as an excuse.

Unless you have a source for this I missed, you don't know this is true either.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#126

Post by SnowHill9902 »

skissane wrote: post #102

> Rabbi Yirmeya raises a dilemma: If one leg of the chick was within fifty cubits of the dovecote, and one legwas beyond fifty cubits, what is the halakha? The Gemara comments: And it was for his question about this far-fetched scenario that they removed Rabbi Yirmeya from the study hall, as he was apparently wasting the Sages’ time. The irony of this strikes me - all the other Rabbis are applauded for their far-fetc…

It’s a joke and a reference to another part. That’s the problem with referring to the Talmud in secular non-Jewish circles. People have misunderstood it for millennia with extremely negative repercussions. There’s a case in Menachot 37a where someone asks a similarly ridiculous question about conjoined twins which later is recorded as occurring. So the Talmud should never be understood literally. It’s trying to teach us that everything can happen, that there are no stupid questions but sometimes there are stupid questions, the irony of life.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#127

Post by SnowHill9902 »

inglor_cz wrote: post #117

Poor rabbi Yirmeya was kicked out for being ahead of his time. As an IT security guy, he would have been spot on; these weird edge scenarios are where 0-days thrive. And some hacker from China will always find a way how to glue the chick with one leg here and the other one there. Of course, King Solomon would just order the chick to be cloven in half. But that doesn't address the vulnerability in a systemic way.

It’s a joke.

King Salomon never cut something in half to appease both sides. That’s a very common misunderstanding. He threatened to do that in order to see which woman cried the most, who he understood as being the real mother. It was never the idea to cut a person in half.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#128

Post by akyu »

boole1854 wrote: post #30
akyu wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does it make you tense up?

Gentile here, but even I tense up when I see discussions about the Talmud show up in "Gentile spaces". Some reasons: 1) Conspiracies. There's a millennia-long history of conspiracy theories involving the Talmud, and talk about the Talmud often see conspiracy theorists surface which sidetracks any rational discussion. 2) Religion. To this day, there is a significant group of religion Jews who take the Talmud extremely…

Thanks. I learned something new.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#129

Post by TchoBeer »

skissane wrote: post #102

> Rabbi Yirmeya raises a dilemma: If one leg of the chick was within fifty cubits of the dovecote, and one legwas beyond fifty cubits, what is the halakha? The Gemara comments: And it was for his question about this far-fetched scenario that they removed Rabbi Yirmeya from the study hall, as he was apparently wasting the Sages’ time. The irony of this strikes me - all the other Rabbis are applauded for their far-fetc…

I haven't done this in like 5 years, but iirc he was basically asking an annoying hypothetical that was already answered by a previous ruling, as opposed to the questions quoted in the article which have theoretical value.

Re: Bizarre Talmudic Scenarios

#130

Post by TchoBeer »

mgiampapa wrote: post #80
TchoBeer wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a lot of Jewish communities in Brooklyn and it's hard to know what you're referring to, but if I am correct, they're so insulated against the outside world that they could really move anywhere (and often do, for cheaper housing prices, as has happened to many a modern orthodox community)

Yeah, that's the thing I don't understand. NYC is known as a melting pot of cultures and it isn't inexpensive at all, even out at the far ends of the NRD and B trains. Why be in a great cosmopolitan city if you aren't going to give your neighbor the time of day when you go out and interact? It's not like I'm talking about interactions at a Yeshiva or a Synagogue, but out doing every day things like shopping, or going…

They live there because they immigrated through new York and settled down in New York. That doesn't mean they're required to integrate with the modern world, as much as that attitude disgusts me.
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