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Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

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Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#211

Post by tablespoon »

blueflow wrote: post #207
tablespoon wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Absolutely. I didn't pick "70" randomly. > ... prick move. No it isn't. Also, aren't you German ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31001842 )? Would you agree that the lesson of Nazi Germany is Germans have no grounds to criticize any human rights abuses anywhere in the world ever again? Why are you criticizing the US for human rights abuses? Aren't you a hypocrite? Shouldn't we be talking about the Holocaust,…

Thats fine, where is your Nürnberg Trials equivalent? Which of your politicians have been hanged or gone to jail? Worse, why should we accept Nürnberg as right and just, when the US continuously gets away with their crimes?

> Thats fine, where is your Nürnberg Trials equivalent? Which of your politicians have been hanged or gone to jail?

There is none, because the US didn't lose an aggressive war during which it also exterminated six million people based on ethnicity.

No one in Germany would have been hanged for Nazi crimes if it hasn't lost a war totally.

When you don't lose like that, past human rights abuses are handled differently. For instance, the US government has formally apologized to Japanese Americans for wartime internment and paid reparations for it.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#212

Post by BobbyJo »

panick21_ wrote: post #167
BobbyJo wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the camps in Xinjiang are as bad, or worse than Guantanamo? I think they are worse because: 1) You are put there for your ethnicity and religion, (no suspected crimes are needed for detainment), despite being a Chinese citizen. 2) Freedom of press in the US means we found out bad things were happening in Guantanamo, and the prison has since been mostly wound down. I think Guantanamo is good example of wh…

Freedom of the press doesn't prevent the majority of Americans getting served whole distorted picture of what happened in Iraq and the Middle East in general or just flat out misinformation, or simply no reporting at all. Because there are very few actual journalist on the ground (and even less with any understanding of the local politics), most of the media just gets their information from gov news releases. Eventua…

My mistake. Xinjiang is A-OK then.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#213

Post by lui8906 »

nukemaster wrote: post #66
lui8906 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's the alternative? Someone commits a felony, and then you...? The US is the OECD country with the highest per capita % of incarcerated individuals. By orders of magnitude. So it seems other countries have found other approaches? > Source: Half of the OECD countries have less than 100 people in prison per 100 000 inhabitants. Thirteen have between 100 and 200. Two countries exceed this – Poland with 230 and the…

Whatever California and NYC tried absolutely didn't work so you can't just say "something else."

Who wrote something else? Not sure if you're referring to another comment or I'm being strawmanned? :)

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#214

Post by blueflow »

tablespoon wrote: post #211
blueflow wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thats fine, where is your Nürnberg Trials equivalent? Which of your politicians have been hanged or gone to jail? Worse, why should we accept Nürnberg as right and just, when the US continuously gets away with their crimes?

> Thats fine, where is your Nürnberg Trials equivalent? Which of your politicians have been hanged or gone to jail? There is none, because the US didn't lose an aggressive war during which it also exterminated six million people based on ethnicity. No one in Germany would have been hanged for Nazi crimes if it hasn't lost a war totally . When you don't lose like that, past human rights abuses are handled differently.…

> because the US didn't lose an aggressive war

Saigon didn't happen, sure.

I get it. The US needs to loose, totally.

I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us.

If you like to read my other threads, don't forget this part: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31002000

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#215

Post by BobbyJo »

trasz wrote: post #192
BobbyJo wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tens of thousands passed through Abu Ghraib too in Iraq. A truckload of torture and prisoner abuse done to people of only ONE ethnicity. If we put Iraqis in prison because of their religion and ethnicity, there would have been millions locked up. In Xinjiang, people are put in camps because of their religion and ethnicity, that's why millions are locked up. Key word: because > Some folks in the US govt who were in…

>If we put Iraqis in prison because of their religion and ethnicity, there would have been millions locked up Oh, but you only put there those that you didn't kill in the first place. China, on the other hand, isn't exterminating those people up front.

> China, on the other hand, isn't exterminating those people up front.

That is an interesting argument. I guess delayed death is slightly less bad. Fair enough.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#216

Post by BobbyJo »

lenkite wrote: post #188
BobbyJo wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tens of thousands passed through Abu Ghraib too in Iraq. A truckload of torture and prisoner abuse done to people of only ONE ethnicity. If we put Iraqis in prison because of their religion and ethnicity, there would have been millions locked up. In Xinjiang, people are put in camps because of their religion and ethnicity, that's why millions are locked up. Key word: because > Some folks in the US govt who were in…

> In Xinjiang, people are put in camps because of their religion and ethnicity, that's why millions are locked up. Well, it's not by Religion. If so, China would have ~45 million muslims permanently imprisoned. Contrary to popular belief, the folks in Xinjiang don't make up the majority of Muslims in China. Those would be the Hui who make up ~3% of the population just by themselves. It is indeed deeply distressing th…

Weird how the parts of the world with the least press and human rights are the most against talking about Xinjiang.

Probably just a coincidence tho.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#217

Post by finiteseries »

naoqj wrote: post #17
zthrowaway wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

I think it’s normal to ask questions: if nothing has ever happened to the US for similar abuses, why should something happen to any other countries?

The US isn’t comparable to other countries given its position in the world, and every single other country’s relative weakness in it.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#218

Post by tablespoon »

blueflow wrote: post #214
tablespoon wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Thats fine, where is your Nürnberg Trials equivalent? Which of your politicians have been hanged or gone to jail? There is none, because the US didn't lose an aggressive war during which it also exterminated six million people based on ethnicity. No one in Germany would have been hanged for Nazi crimes if it hasn't lost a war totally . When you don't lose like that, past human rights abuses are handled differently.…

> because the US didn't lose an aggressive war Saigon didn't happen, sure. I get it. The US needs to loose, totally. I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us. If you like to read my other threads, don't forget this part: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31002000

> I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us.

So is this about human rights, or just monomaniacal anti-Americanism?

I'm sure you're aware of the quite Nazi-like aggressive war of conquest happening in Eastern Europe right now, where civilians are being indiscriminately shelled. Why would you want to ally with a country doing something like that?

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#219

Post by blueflow »

tablespoon wrote: post #218
blueflow wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because the US didn't lose an aggressive war Saigon didn't happen, sure. I get it. The US needs to loose, totally. I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us. If you like to read my other threads, don't forget this part: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31002000

> I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us. So is this about human rights, or just monomaniacal anti-Americanism? I'm sure you're aware of the quite Nazi-like aggressive war of conquest happening in Eastern Europe right now, where civilians are being indiscriminately shelled. Why would you want to ally with a country doing something like that?

> Why would you want to ally with a country like that?

Same about bombing of Korea and Vietnam. Why should anyone want to be allied with the US?

> where civilians are being indiscriminately shelled

North Korea.

You are quick to point fingers, fix your own country first.

Re: Former Xinjiang prisoner arrives in U.S. as key witness to abuses

#220

Post by tablespoon »

blueflow wrote: post #219
tablespoon wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think the EU should ally up with China and Russia. Korea and Vietnam will probably also want to join us. So is this about human rights, or just monomaniacal anti-Americanism? I'm sure you're aware of the quite Nazi-like aggressive war of conquest happening in Eastern Europe right now, where civilians are being indiscriminately shelled. Why would you want to ally with a country doing something like that?

> Why would you want to ally with a country like that? Same about bombing of Korea and Vietnam. Why should anyone want to be allied with the US? > where civilians are being indiscriminately shelled North Korea. You are quick to point fingers, fix your own country first.

> Same about bombing of Korea and Vietnam. Why should anyone want to be allied with the US?

I don't know, maybe ask some South Koreans and find out?

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