Live data from Hacker News

An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

jaapgrolleman.com

271–280 of 559 posts

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#271
post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better was the government statement “TraceTogether is used for infection control and isolation only”. Then a year later they used it to solve a crime. When called out on the prior statement said “oh, well, we’d only use it for serious crimes”. They then pass a bill legalizing using it for criminal investigations.

Sounds good to me. Singapore is the only country you could walk around with 10k hanging out of your back pocket and no one will touch you. Friend left their phone in mall bathroom and 4 hours later when she went back it was still there.

I mean hey, if authoritarianism is a plus to you, have at it. Not to mention the government promising X, then doing the opposite, then quietly passing a law to make it legal.

And no, petty theft is not that uncommon in Singapore, it’s just not broadly reported on. Not to mention the 3 public knife incidents in the last few weeks.

Yes, you can leave stuff on a table, yes it’s remarkably safe to walk around at night, but to pretend things don’t get stolen, people don’t get robbed is fanciful but regularly promoted by the government.

I friend of a friend worked for the SPF and said “a lot of crime never makes the news”.

And don’t get me wrong it’s a very unique place with a lot of benefits. But it’s also a system with some weak checks and balances that so far has been run by pretty benevolent leaders, but it’s a bit weird being there and seeing it in action. There is definitely a bit of “if we don’t talk about it it’s not a problem”.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#272
post #270

This is what annoys me about the US COVID protesters. We really didn’t have lockdowns in the US. A lockdown is when you have curfews, can’t go out, can’t travel at all, etc. I saw little of that in the US and what was there was sparsely enforced to the point of being not much more than a suggestion.

Perhaps if you had invested your life savings into a business, which was then forced to be shut down, you would have more sympathy.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#273
> People are finding out that state media exists not for accurate news, but only to spin reality into a narrative that fits the powers higher up.

Are people really finding that out only now? I thought that this was generally accepted knowledge even in China, despite the constant fear and propaganda they live with.

What's happening now with the strict lockdowns and zero-Covid policy is inhumane. People are literally prisoners in their own homes and anyone in a position of power will abuse it to avoid hurting their social score. What a fucked up situation.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#274

It seems like condos and apartments can easily be turned into prisons. I'm glad I live in a house, even if it is in north america.

>100% of all villages had erected strict and high barriers to quarantine their villages off from the rest of the China.

https://www.ifpri.org/blog/lockdowns-are-protecting-chinas-r...

You may not be locked inside your house but you can still be locked in your village, which may not have food either.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#275

Kind of crazy how sentimental and emotional the response is with barely any actual discussion going on about the merits of this on a grand scale. Yes, stories about people's dogs and temporary economic depression are awful. The larger picture is that China by pursuing these policies has stopped millions of deaths, probably tens of millions of cases of long term disabilities, and overall kept the economy going. It's w…

> The larger picture is that China by pursuing these policies has stopped millions of deaths, probably tens of millions of cases of long term disabilities, and overall kept the economy going.

I think it's a little disingenious to use the word "stopped" in that way. It would be far more accurate to have said "delayed".

Maybe we should all refresh ourselves on what the most common causes of death are by age group. For the US, the data is here:

https://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/LeadingCauses.html

https://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/pdf/leading_causes_of_dea...

the second link is apparently the latest dataset available, for 2018.

Am I the only one who thinks it's going to be interesting to see where exactly Covid ranks once we get round to having data for 2020 onwards?

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is likely lockdowns achieve very little, only delaying the inevitable surge of cases and deaths for a later date. Also, they lie about their numbers. Locked down population with restructed internet access and no independent media can lose 50% to an epidemy and we'll know nothing.

Lockdowns achieve exactly what they are meant to achieve: they stop the spread of disease. This is mainly aimed at avoiding uncontrolled surges and collapse of the healthcare system and is effective for that. However, indeed, this must be 'step 1' and combined with a broader strategy of vaccination and controlled exposure to the virus otherwise you only end up with an infinite cycle of lockdowns. One issue in China i…

> Lockdowns achieve exactly what they are meant to achieve: they stop the spread of disease. This is mainly aimed at avoiding uncontrolled surge and collapse of the health care system

That may be true, but you can apparently stop the spread of disease [and] collapse of the health care system without lockdowns.

Look at Sweden. Anders Tegnell was relentlessly vilified by the mainstream media since 2020, yet the non-lockdown strategy appears to have led to an "average" outcome over the long term.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#277

Kind of crazy how sentimental and emotional the response is with barely any actual discussion going on about the merits of this on a grand scale. Yes, stories about people's dogs and temporary economic depression are awful. The larger picture is that China by pursuing these policies has stopped millions of deaths, probably tens of millions of cases of long term disabilities, and overall kept the economy going. It's w…

[deleted]

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lockdowns achieve exactly what they are meant to achieve: they stop the spread of disease. This is mainly aimed at avoiding uncontrolled surges and collapse of the healthcare system and is effective for that. However, indeed, this must be 'step 1' and combined with a broader strategy of vaccination and controlled exposure to the virus otherwise you only end up with an infinite cycle of lockdowns. One issue in China i…

With such high vaccination rates in many places why didn’t we see a corresponding reduction in Covid infections? Why are vaccinated people getting infected?

The vaccines do not prevent infection but reduce the ultimate harm of the infection.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#279

Kind of crazy how sentimental and emotional the response is with barely any actual discussion going on about the merits of this on a grand scale. Yes, stories about people's dogs and temporary economic depression are awful. The larger picture is that China by pursuing these policies has stopped millions of deaths, probably tens of millions of cases of long term disabilities, and overall kept the economy going. It's w…

Maybe this site needs an 'Are you a Robot' captcha because you sound like one. Geez. How cold do you have to be to not understand that being imprisoned or not being able to feed your children might make you 'emotional?'

May not have read the article fully.

Re: An Account of the Shanghai Lockdown

#280

As a Chinese, I can say that the situation is worse than it in the article. My brother is a student who lives in a flat and has not eaten for two days and no one has brought basic substances. He can't leave the flat, he turns to his tutor but his tutor is also forced to stay at home (eating instant noodles every day). We are worried about him but there is nothing we can do, if we criticise the government on chinese T…

That's deplorable, I hope everything works out all right.
Post reply on HN