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The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

sabukaru.online

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Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#351

Post by nimithryn »

bpiche wrote: post #307
nimithryn wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To each his own, but I don’t think the length of the book has anything to do with the clarity of the narrative. And I’m definitely not arguing that Stephenson writes novels that are less confusing than Gibson in general (I liked Anathem! But cmon) I’m just arguing that the style in Snow Crash spells out what’s going on more literally than in Neuromancer.

I'm not using this reply to agree or disagree, I just want to share this piece of internet archeology with you. If you're interested in comparing and contrasting great cyberpunk authors, the esteemed Rudy Rucker himself did this in an interview with punk-cyber legend R U Sirius (of R U A Cyberpunk? meme fame) on his blog back in the day https://www.acceler8or.com/2012/02/cyberpunk-sfmathematics-l...

The comparison with the Beats is interesting (I know next to nothing about the Beats). Thanks for sharing!

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#353

Post by VintageCool »

pmoriarty wrote: post #346
barry-cotter wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dry and boring I can imagine people calling Egan or Vinge but unimaginative? They both throw off ideas like confetti.

Here's an example I remember from some Vinge novel ( "A Fire Upon the Deep" maybe) I read decades ago: some ancient species/entities were supposed to have transcended a long time ago. What did that transcendence consist of? Where did they go? What's their life like after transcendence? Vinge gives the reader nothing. I call that a failure of the imagination. Yes, I get that the post-singularity world is supposed to u…

Well, he doesn't know. Most of Vinge's works were about getting close to the Singularity without crossing over, because he expected that technology and society would change massively and unpredictably at that time.

The point of introducing the fantasy element of the Zones of Thought was to allow Vinge to write a FTL space opera without having to deal with post-Singularity speculation.

When species transcended, they left the Beyond and went into the Transcend.

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#354

Post by VintageCool »

smegger001 wrote: post #336
pydry wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>How's that working out? Cuz it doesn't look like it's doing much except creating painfully generic stock villains Those tiki torch people arent exactly running the country now are they?

they were a couple of years ago

and they might be again in a few years

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#355

Post by porbelm »

pkdpic wrote: post #247
mmaunder wrote: post #68

I’m constantly amazed at how Metaverse aficionados quote Snow Crash and and other 1990s works as cornerstones of cyberspace, when Gibson invented the term and Neuromancer was written in 1984. Gibson is the original. The passage where Case connects to the matrix (also a Gibson term) again for the first time once his nervous system is repaired is heartbreakingly beautiful. I relate to it as a young phone phreak growing…

And didn't Gibson write the screenplay for the film adaptation of Johnny Mnemonic where they coined the term iPhone in that one random scene for two seconds? Or did I imagine that? Anyway I guess thats like the opposite of cyberpunk... or is it? :shrug-emoji:

Nah, it's an EYE phone not an i-phone

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#356

Post by wink »

sho_hn wrote: post #232
Krasnol wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany here. Besides Squid Game and Parasite, I've not heard of most of them and in the case of PUBG, I wasn't aware it was from SK or in any way special in this seemingly endless pool of "the same game with another skin"-genre.

Sure, but is there a Chinese or Japanese or Indonesian film or TV show you think just as many people around you know from the same time frame? And I mean, that's still anecdotal - what isn't anecdotal is that the upscale KaDeWe department store I live nearby in Berlin had a Korea week a while ago, and so on. And whose pop music export has flash mobs and dance troupes dancing to it in the streets of every major city f…

I've also not noticed anything besides Squid Game and Parasite here in Germany. Also not sure about the esports thing, maybe I'm looking in the wrong corner. 20 years ago when StarCraft was still on people's minds there was a meme about Koreans, but since then I wouldn't say there was anything spectacularly popular.

And because a few K-Pop bands are now a bit more famous I wouldn't call this a hype cycle. Then again it's hard to tell, I've not been to a department store for 2 years, but I've not heard of any flash mob thingy in literal years. Maybe you're projecting Berlin's weirdness to the rest of us and it's just not there ;)

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#357

Post by zrav »

TranquilMarmot wrote: post #302
zrav wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as the Witcher games are basically fan fiction paying homage to Sapkowskis books, CP2077 needs to be seen as a homage to many classics of the cyberpunk genre. Neuromancer, Snow Crash, Blade Runner, Ghost in the Shell to name a few obvious ones (I also see a lot of Elysium in it, FWIW). The story CD Projekt synthesized based on the concepts of these works is very fitting and surprisingly consistent, IMO. And beca…

Isn't it based off of the Cyberpunk TTRPG? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk_(role-playing_game) I also loved the game. Really don't understand all the hate it received.

Yes, it is of course based on the Cyberpunk TTRPG IP, which sets many world building aspects. However if compare the content of the Cyberpunk 2020 TTRPG guidebook with what is in 2077 you'll quickly notice the monumental difference in scope and how much the latter drew of these other works in ways obvious and subtle.

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#358

Post by pas »

dleslie wrote: post #187
Mountain_Skies wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to gatekeep but corporate produced anything cannot be punk. At most, they can serve as a rent seeker for passing along punk to the masses but that's not even what Cyberpunk 2077 is. This is 100% corporate, focus grouped, committee approved, beige trying too hard to be punk. Which is fine if taken for what it really is but what it really is, which isn't punk.

Try to gatekeep all you want; but punks failed to defend their anti-corporate credibility and not only tolerated, but embraced corporate appropriation of their culture. They rode out punk's credibility while riding on boards from Zumies, wearing Hot Topic, and listening to Sum 41 . CDPR is about as authentic as you'll find in high-budget video game development; and as I enjoy high-fidelity entertainment, as well as P…

hm. a lot of people imitating the cool punk kids indeed wore similar clothing and went to concerts of punk-ish bands.

and indeed many original punk bands found commercial success

does that somehow invalidate punks? at best it shows that - like all (?) things before it - punk was also consumed by consumerism.

Re: The Influence of Neuromancer on Cyberpunk

#360

Post by krapp »

pas wrote: post #358
dleslie wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try to gatekeep all you want; but punks failed to defend their anti-corporate credibility and not only tolerated, but embraced corporate appropriation of their culture. They rode out punk's credibility while riding on boards from Zumies, wearing Hot Topic, and listening to Sum 41 . CDPR is about as authentic as you'll find in high-budget video game development; and as I enjoy high-fidelity entertainment, as well as P…

hm. a lot of people imitating the cool punk kids indeed wore similar clothing and went to concerts of punk-ish bands. and indeed many original punk bands found commercial success does that somehow invalidate punks? at best it shows that - like all (?) things before it - punk was also consumed by consumerism.

>does that somehow invalidate punks?

Yes. When a movement whose entire thesis is "fuck the establishment" gets co-opted by the establishment, it becomes invalid as a movement, a hollow and pathetic shell of itself. Punk is anti-society, anti-religion, anti-government, anti-authority, anti-conformity, anti everything, even anti-music to a degree. Its relevance died as soon as the last punk lived past 30 and it became old people music. Just another style to buy at Hot Topic.

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