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A better way to rate films

blog.goodfil.ms

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Re: A better way to rate films

#31
post #12

I really disagree with the premise of this post. Emotional impact (United 93), psychological impact (Black Swan), intellectual demands (Primer) all equate to a lower rewatchability score, since watching the movie takes a lot out of me. However, the more of an impact a movie makes, the higher my opinion of a movie. Because something is light and fluffy doesn't make that movie "better", it just means it's easier to wat…

I think a problem with "rewatchability" is that it can vary drastically with the amount of viewings. I'm going to substitute Aliens for Transformers, because "watchable" is not a word I would use to describe Transformers.

Aliens is very rewatchable. It has tense but predictable action (the aliens kill everyone, "get away from her", etc.). Sure, it's best the first time, but Aliens only ceases to be rewatchable when you get tired of watching Aliens.

Films like Primer, Fight Club, and The Usual Suspects, are very rewatchable once, with a sharp decline afterwards. The Soze/Durden effect is incredible once. The next time, you want to watch very closely to catch all of the obvious hints that you missed. You might still miss some, but not many. By the fourth time, it's almost pointless.

Re: A better way to rate films

#32
post #6

One thing that movie ratings don't take into account, including this one, is: what am I in the mood for? I'd like to type into netflix, "I'm in the mood for James Bond meets Spirited Away", have it perhaps give me a few yes/no choices, and make recommendations based on that.

This is the main thing Jinni claims to do. Have you tried it? http://www.jinni.com/

I also strongly recommend http://tastekid.com/ . The recommendations are great, although it tends to give them very narrowly (very similar movies, rather than related movies you might enjoy but are in a different style). The name is also very unfortunate, but I love it.

Re: A better way to rate films

#33
Discolsure: I am a co-founder for a movie recommendation site called tellmetwin.com so I am biased towards our own rating system...

I have never considered the rewatchability criteria as a potential factor in rating a movie, but must admit that is has appeal. But thinking about it further, it is a very personal metric so would not be very useful in determining the overall watchability of a movie. I.e. if you consider a movie rewatchable it might not correlate with me considering it to be watchable.

I would love to be able to see a plot of individuals and how their ratings cluster (some interesting visual way of adding and removing individuals would be cool) because I would guess (based on our own data) that these plots would not be uniform. And if they are not, then an individual's movie recommendation, based on rewatchability, would have less value to me.

Re: A better way to rate films

#34
post #31
post #12

I really disagree with the premise of this post. Emotional impact (United 93), psychological impact (Black Swan), intellectual demands (Primer) all equate to a lower rewatchability score, since watching the movie takes a lot out of me. However, the more of an impact a movie makes, the higher my opinion of a movie. Because something is light and fluffy doesn't make that movie "better", it just means it's easier to wat…

I think a problem with "rewatchability" is that it can vary drastically with the amount of viewings. I'm going to substitute Aliens for Transformers , because "watchable" is not a word I would use to describe Transformers . Aliens is very rewatchable. It has tense but predictable action (the aliens kill everyone, "get away from her", etc.). Sure, it's best the first time, but Aliens only ceases to be rewatchable when…

It's funny, because it makes me realize that for me, "rewatchability" is in large part all about catching all the details I missed the first time around. But I'm not sure if it's like that for other people or not. And it doesn't necessarily mean that I didn't enjoy it at least once. Some things are only good once. After that, there's just no point in watching them again.

Re: A better way to rate films

#35
post #12

I really disagree with the premise of this post. Emotional impact (United 93), psychological impact (Black Swan), intellectual demands (Primer) all equate to a lower rewatchability score, since watching the movie takes a lot out of me. However, the more of an impact a movie makes, the higher my opinion of a movie. Because something is light and fluffy doesn't make that movie "better", it just means it's easier to wat…

Indeed. I could rewatch some movies effectively an infinite number of times. But that doesn't mean I think they are the best films, or the films I would put at the top of the list of recommendations for a friend.

Re: A better way to rate films

#36
This is purely a way to rate movies for entertainment value. Which means although the method may be better, the end result is very likely to barely differ from the current abysmal state of IMDB ratings.

Re: A better way to rate films

#37
It's still broken, just differently (maybe better) broken.

Films, music, books, etc. are not about some abstract universal gradation of quality that a large enough, good enough statistical sampling of viewers will reveal with increasing precision. No, they are art. Enjoyment and appreciation of art is a matter of personal taste, which is not, will not, and cannot be universal for everyone.

That's why up/down votes are decent enough ratings systems despite their crudeness, all they do is tell people whether or not taking the effort to find out if a piece of art suits your personal taste is likely to be worthwhile.

Ultimately what ratings are trying to get at is recommendations. The simplest idea being to measure the average opinion of everyone and present the highest rated works as recommendations. However, more sophisticated systems which try to find people with similar taste and recommend to you things that they seem to like but you haven't been exposed to are likely to be more successful, though significantly more complex to implement. It seems unlikely that even that represents the limit of improvement for the problem, but nobody's done much better yet.

Re: A better way to rate films

#39
I like the term "rewatchability" but I don't agree with your logic.

Why would you limit your pool of advice-givers to your friends?

They are good for service advice where you need someone you can trust to give you the whole and honest story.

In movies it's beyond that, it's much more important to find people with the closest match to you in movie taste as possible. The more people the closer taste match you will get (goes without saying).

I also don't see the point of giving "quality" scores. I really don't care if a stranger thinks some movie was of high or low quality. I'd much rather know if my taste-twin loved it or hated it. I for example thought Lord of the Rings was super well done and yet super boring. But this opinion of mine only matters to someone who resembles me in movie taste, who hates and loves the same quirky things as I do about movies. And of the two opinions i mentioned (well done, boring) its really only the latter that matters to my twin, he/she should pay most attention to that when deciding if to go and see the Lord, not if I thought the movie was of high or low quality.

But having said that, I like "rewatchability" as a concept to study further. I too would rip of my nails before seeing Black Swan again but I still thought it was a masterpiece. However, I have seen Requim for a Dream (Darren's Arrenovsky's previous movie) again and again although it was also very emotionally intense like the Swan. Just in a different way, less depressive, but killer strong in an exhaustive yet positive way. And then.. yet and still.. I would recommend both movies to everyone I meet. I think both are a must see even though one of them I would never want to see again.

Re: A better way to rate films

#40
Surprisingly doesn't mention IMDB which has by far the best general purpose ratings.

Curious if they considered "Would you watch this movie again? [yes/no]"

I also wonder if NetPromoter could be adapted for rating things like movies. It uses the question "Would you recommend..." and has a much harsher formula (+1 for 9/10, -1 for 0-6).

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