Live data from Hacker News

The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

newyorker.com

21–30 of 60 posts

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#21
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, taking part in every protest against Putin in the last 12 years, being detained at a protest wasn't enough punishment for me. I should better perish in the announced coming purge of the fifth column, because persons like you like to feel good about themselves making statements like this one you made. You people are exactly like the ones who were turning away Jews fleeing the Nazi Germany. And if you think that…

Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar or cross into personal attack, no matter how provocative another comment is. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Ok, sorry.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#22
post #19
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

What Republic of Utopia are you from? By those standards, the Ukrainian people should be punished for their persistent history of corruption. After all, in 2014, Ukraine was parallel with Nigeria on a global corruption index - and it has been significantly below too. As for the Ukrainians doing "a lot" to fight corruption, it seems not yet to have worked so well. Zelensky himself is featured in the Pandora Papers[0]…

Ukrainians revolt, and then try a new guy. Russians, in the other hand, overwhelmingly support the same guy through everything he does. There's almost no resistance. The population feels they have no responsibility, that the higher ups always do what's right. And this is the result, Russians confused about why anyone may be upset at them.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#23

There is no way this war is fought for the benefit of Russia as a whole, not even in the form of a neo soviet union. Russia isn't threatened directly by the west, nuclear weapons are a sufficient deterrent and Europe is a loyal customer of coal, gas and oil. If nuclear weapons grant super power status amongst nations, then Russia is doing everything in its power to reduce its ability to maintain its current nuclear c…

>I sure hope Putin is an evil genius because if he isn't I can only say "Say goodbye to your super power status, Russia, and enjoy your hard fought international insignificance!" I never understood what Putin's end game was here with this war, what can he earn extra of what he doesn't already have? He's already one of the world's richest men and he's already quite old. Couldn't he just like take his insane wealth and…

Might sound stupid but perhaps it's the same restlessness everyone has?

What do I now after building my home? Doing the garden. Okay what now?

Also a little bit like CK: he was musturbating in front of a few woman in the office and did not get spoken out.

He took the Crimea without real troubles perhaps this combined with him being allowed to poison people around the world and hacking the west gave him the feeling that he can just take Ukraine.

On his level he probably can't even just walk around in a crowd of people. That has to feel to him very unnatural.

If you have everything legacy might become your driving motivation. Unfortunately he doesn't think legacy could mean making as many life's good but territorial restoration.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#24
post #18
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Advocating for collective punishment is a serious breach of the site guidelines and is not allowed here, regardless of how right you are or feel you are on a topic. No more of this, please. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

The guidelines do not contain any mention of punishment. And if a sanction is punishment, we are not allowed to discuss if sanctions and what level of them is okay?

It's one thing to say "I recognize that individual Russians are not at fault, but in the middle of a total war civilians inevitably get caught in the crossfire. At least with these economic weapons no one is getting killed."

It's another to say "you are all at fault, even if indirectly, and so you all deserve to be punished."

That second comment would violate at least "be kind" and "comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#25
post #13
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Advocating for collective punishment is a serious breach of the site guidelines and is not allowed here, regardless of how right you are or feel you are on a topic. No more of this, please. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

I think he meant punishement as in sanctions

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#26
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Quoted post unavailable.

Ultimately, the only legitimate way to remove Putin is for its people to evict him, either through election or protestation. There are only so many ways to increase the pressure at the international level that won't impact the lives of the casual citizen of Russia.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#27

It would be so much easier for any skilled worker to flee Russia if various western companies would stop virtue signalling and stop this trend of cancelling all services for Russians. By doing this they feel good, but are actually helping Putin and his criminal gang. I was ready for our criminal government to start building a Russian Firewall to hinder access to non-government propaganda for Russian Citizens, but I w…

You're angry. I understand. No one likes having services taken away.

I work with Russians. I see accounts getting cut off or threatened to be cut off. But none of the firms are saying "we'll stop providing services to Russians". They are saying "we'll stop doing business in the Russian economy". Russian citizens are still very much using Figma, for example. But not in Russia, through Russian companies, using Russian credit cards. Conversely, non-Russian immigrants in Russia are also cut off. Ukrainians working in Russia are getting cut off.

The reason is the sanctions and the difficulty of complying with them. It's way easier to implement via geofencing, or by denying Russian-registered payment cards, than by checking users and companies against the ever-changing sanctions lists manually. And yes, many companies are horrified by the war and want to do something about it. Maybe something more than the sanctions require.

The purpose is to punish the Russian state and curtail its finance of the war. It doesn't really matter if Vasya Designer from Voronezh curses Putin and the war over tea at the dining room table every day. Putin doesn't care what Vasya thinks. So long as he keeps working, making money, paying his taxes, he contributes to the economy. His inner feelings do not affect the war. Even if there are many like him, it's unclear how they will change policy. 15 years, torture stories, and footage of crackdowns from Minsk to Almaty are pretty scary. They keep Putin from having to care what Vasya thinks, or how many think like him.

I know good people in Russia who can't leave and won't leave. It makes me sad, too, seeing them cut off, isolated, worried about money and their children. But it's the news from Ukraine that makes me truly angry.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#28

There is no way this war is fought for the benefit of Russia as a whole, not even in the form of a neo soviet union. Russia isn't threatened directly by the west, nuclear weapons are a sufficient deterrent and Europe is a loyal customer of coal, gas and oil. If nuclear weapons grant super power status amongst nations, then Russia is doing everything in its power to reduce its ability to maintain its current nuclear c…

My armchair thoughts are perhaps this is happening now because Putin knows it's a last chance to do something "big" due to his age, declining demographics in Russia, and/or aging of their nuclear and military arsenal.

Or perhaps he's making a bet on abandoning the West to instead be Chinese dependent, and there's something in it for him and his cronies. Seems China would benefit from all this.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#29
post #18
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Advocating for collective punishment is a serious breach of the site guidelines and is not allowed here, regardless of how right you are or feel you are on a topic. No more of this, please. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

The guidelines do not contain any mention of punishment. And if a sanction is punishment, we are not allowed to discuss if sanctions and what level of them is okay?

The site guidelines for comments begin with Be kind. It's hard to imagine an uglier absence of kindness on the internet than advocating for vengeance against an entire population. If you want to make a policy point you can do it without that level of inhumanity.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Edit: you've already managed to break the site guidelines repeatedly in multiple threads on multiple topics. That's not a good sign. If you'd please review the guidelines and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.

Re: The Russians Fleeing Putin's Wartime Crackdown

#30
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What Republic of Utopia are you from? By those standards, the Ukrainian people should be punished for their persistent history of corruption. After all, in 2014, Ukraine was parallel with Nigeria on a global corruption index - and it has been significantly below too. As for the Ukrainians doing "a lot" to fight corruption, it seems not yet to have worked so well. Zelensky himself is featured in the Pandora Papers[0]…

Ukrainians revolt, and then try a new guy. Russians, in the other hand, overwhelmingly support the same guy through everything he does. There's almost no resistance. The population feels they have no responsibility, that the higher ups always do what's right. And this is the result, Russians confused about why anyone may be upset at them.

On what basis you say that 'there's almost no resistance'? Have you seen anti-war protests? Do you know the potential personal costs of such protests?
Post reply on HN