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Windows needs a change in priorities

den.dev

431–440 of 884 posts

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#431

I read through the nearly 400 comments and no one brought up using the LTSC edition of Windows, which actually gets out of your way or that you don't own the OS when you use a proprietary operating system. I'm not really sure what to make of this as it seems people prefer to complain as if they were hostages to the whims of others. I buy my computers with Linux pre-installed on supported machines. All those complaint…

I don't think even the LTSC edition avoids the UX problems discussed here. All the LTSC does is freeze the features Windows had at release and give you security updates. You're still stuck with whatever was there at launch.

Suggesting switching to an entirely different OS to someone who's complaining that their habitual OS no longer behaves as it used to isn't very useful.

>I'm not really sure what to make of this as it seems people prefer to complain as if they were hostages to the whims of others. I buy my computers with Linux pre-installed on supported machines.

You don't understand because you're failing to empathize with what people are saying, because it's not a problem you personally experience. Let's see if this works: suppose you find a shoe manufacturer that makes these really neat shoes that you love. You love them so much that every time they wear out, you buy the next model from that manufacturer. Each model is slightly different from the last, but you like all of them better than the competition. As you've gotten used to them, you've started to develop certain habits with these shoes, such as a technique to tie the laces that makes you do it very fast. But over time, the manufacturer has started to change the way it makes the shoes, such that they're not as comfortable as they used to be, or some of your habits no longer work with them. Now, you don't want to buy from a different manufacturer. At this point your feet are accustomed to the way these shoes fit, and other shoes feel completely different, even if in some ways they're objectively better. You don't want shoes from a different brand, you want the shoes this one used to make, which used to be so much better than this.

TL;DR: Something can be worse than it used to be, and still be better than the alternatives.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is popular because it filled a niche where next to nothing existed, so for people in those fields anything is a step up. For people like me forced to come over from Visual Studio and other editors, it's a huge step down. For example, instead of making improvements to the PowerShell Integrated Scripting Environment (ISE), Microsoft marked it as deprecated and "forced" everyone over to Visual Studio Code, whether th…

I don't think the (not very good) PowerShell extension is a great basis for judging VS Code as a whole. I've spent most of my career in Visual Studio, I have a great deal of respect for how it just works , nobody's forcing me to leave it and yet... I'm mostly done with it. I'd rather use VS Code for C# development these days; it nails a lot of speed+UX things that Visual Studio doesn't.

Well, from his point of view he's right to judge it, since he's being forced to use it and it's crap for his use case, extensions or not.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#433

I read through the nearly 400 comments and no one brought up using the LTSC edition of Windows, which actually gets out of your way or that you don't own the OS when you use a proprietary operating system. I'm not really sure what to make of this as it seems people prefer to complain as if they were hostages to the whims of others. I buy my computers with Linux pre-installed on supported machines. All those complaint…

Windows knows full well LTSC is pain free but also less profitable. Sales will act really difficult, to sell it to a business unless they complain they are doing something mission critical. Also as far as I know it's difficult to buy LTSC as a private costumer.

Anyone can buy a volume license. You'll need to pay 200ish dollars or so but for an OS you use every day and provided the 400 comments here are indicative of a real desire to use a non-abusive edition of Windows, it's a bargain!

To buy one you'll need to go through a Microsoft Partner as detailed here: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/licensing/how-to-buy/how-to-...

Searching the web for "buy ltsc license" is also fruitful.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#434
It needs a complete rewrite, just like google is doing with Fuschia, betting on the future involve making new choices that are not backward compatible due to security and performance concerns

Backward compatible is not what people want, they want ways to move forward just like how Apple did with Roseta2

We are moving in a world where energy consumption needs to be optimized due to climate change

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#435
post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a cherry-picked example of a very old machine. I've had a bug-free experience with the XPS 13 Developer Edition and Purism's line of laptops (I won't comment on the hardware quality of Purism's laptops here because that's a separate issue). I'm expecting a Framework soon, which touts official support for Fedora so looking forward to yet another bug-free experience there.

Why cherry-picked? It is what I got the fortune of owning, same thing can happen to anyone else. XPS 13 Developer Edition you say? https://medium.com/@AlexMichelOrg/like-linux-then-dont-buy-d...

Yes but it's an extremely old example and not at all indicative of the environment around owning a Linux-shipped laptop today.

Have you owned and used an XPS 13 Developer Edition? Because now it just looks like you're driving around the internet for examples of things that prop up your argument.

I have one I use every day and have for the three years I've owned it. It works great on Ubuntu and Arch Linux. No complaints.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#436
post #427

I read through the nearly 400 comments and no one brought up using the LTSC edition of Windows, which actually gets out of your way or that you don't own the OS when you use a proprietary operating system. I'm not really sure what to make of this as it seems people prefer to complain as if they were hostages to the whims of others. I buy my computers with Linux pre-installed on supported machines. All those complaint…

> consider paying for a volume license for LTSC And if I just want a single Windows machine and not 5?

Unfortunately, this is the price you pay to let Microsoft know the OS you want respects you as a user.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of software not on Linux or that doesn't run well on Linux. People pick their OS based on what software they want to run, not the other way around. And they pick from what they can buy. Go into a BestBuy and you can choose between Windows machines, Apple machines, and a few Chromebooks. If you did manage to buy a Linux machine somewhere, you are going to be disappointed when you go back into that BestBu…

But the issue here is not inherently with Linux. It is more so with vendors of printers making drivers. If Brother feels that there are enough people running Linux and want to own a Brother printer, they will make the driver. Maybe that is the issue we need solve, or at least the part we need to be vocal about. If brother gets a significant number of emails asking for linux support, perhaps they will finally make lin…

> But the issue here is not inherently with Linux. It is more so with vendors of printers making drivers.

Users don't care. For them things either work or not. Users are not going to e-mail Brother or Nvidia or Microsoft to fix their issues with printers, video cards or Onedrive. How is that so hard to understand?

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish this was true, but there are a heck of a lot of office workers who have grown up with Windows and can never be trained to use anything else. You'll get a lot of resistance and rationalisation about why they don't think Linux or BSD or whatever isn't as good, and that the training time is better used to just work.

You're not wrong, but office users should be locked to a browser in 2022 anyway. What do they need Windows for? They can all use a web browser. Microsoft has done an amazing job convincing the office world they need Windows, when they don't need a single feature that it provides in 99% of cases.

I think you’re projecting, and severely unfamiliar with the software.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#439

I read through the nearly 400 comments and no one brought up using the LTSC edition of Windows, which actually gets out of your way or that you don't own the OS when you use a proprietary operating system. I'm not really sure what to make of this as it seems people prefer to complain as if they were hostages to the whims of others. I buy my computers with Linux pre-installed on supported machines. All those complaint…

I don't think even the LTSC edition avoids the UX problems discussed here. All the LTSC does is freeze the features Windows had at release and give you security updates. You're still stuck with whatever was there at launch. Suggesting switching to an entirely different OS to someone who's complaining that their habitual OS no longer behaves as it used to isn't very useful. >I'm not really sure what to make of this as…

> You don't understand because you're failing to empathize with what people are saying, because it's not a problem you personally experience.

To be clear I support my wife's LTSC install and use Windows 11 with WSL and WSLg for work.

> I don't think even the LTSC edition avoids the UX problems discussed here.

I think it does but please highlight which problems it doesnt avoid.

> suppose you find a shoe manufacturer that makes these really neat shoes that you love.

Do they respect me as a user? What are their capital incentives? If not aligned with mine why do I love them? Can I change my purchasing habits so their capital incentives align? If not, I should probably do something less rage-inducing for my own health.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#440
post #299
post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Linux still barely works in 2022 I have had zero problem running linux as my daily driver for the last 10 years, care to explain your comment? The only problem that I have is that video games don't always work because the developers don't care.

I see this argument in every thread about Linux. There's always this one magical user where everything "just works", has had 0 issues and everything's just dandy.

What are some specific issues? Most of the stuff I hear is either hardware related or some software someone used on Windows doesn't exist on Linux. For hardware issues it depends on the hardware you're using. Since most drivers aren't open source, full Linux support often comes a while after it's released. I don't use the most recent hardware and haven't had a problem where something doesn't "just work" in years. I don't even remember the last time. Not being able to use cutting edge hardware is a price I'm willing to pay because it actually saves you money. This is also why there is a big push for open hardware.
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