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AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

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Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#71

Post by jaywalk »

RobertMiller wrote: post #36
jaywalk wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My oven is Internet connected. It can't be turned on remotely unless I press a button on the oven itself, and even then it'll only allow it once. The WiFi functionality is also such total garbage that it'll only stay connected for a few days, and requires physically unplugging and re-plugging the power to the oven to get it to reconnect.

> It can't be turned on remotely unless I press a button on the oven itself, and even then it'll only allow it once. That it's possible at all suggests that the oven is only one bad firmware update away from turning itself on when you don't intend it. Conceivably such a limitation could be built into the hardware; e.g. with a button that works like a circuit breaker. Set to break after the oven starts once and requir…

I agree with you. But it's just the oven, so the risk is just wasting some gas and heating my house up a little until I notice. The cooktop burners can't be operated remotely, so there's no risk of unintended open flames.

Also, because of the crappy WiFi it's almost never connected anyway.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#73

Post by tombert »

I worry that there will be a day, similar to the problem we currently have with TVs, that it will be difficult (or even impossible) to buy non-smart kitchen appliances.

I still don't see the point of my fridge being connected to wifi, but I'll admit that I might just be a bit of a Luddite.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#74

Post by jaywalk »

Nextgrid wrote: post #52

Why is there no user-facing firmware update/recovery feature, so that at least tech-savvy users can resolve the issue themselves? Or a reset feature that reverts to the factory firmware located on a separate, read-only chip? Ah yes, it's to prevent people downgrading or running "unauthorized" firmware when they inevitably start adding user-hostile "features".

It's probably more about cost savings than anything else. Why add a USB port and the associated functionality required to do manual updates when it's got a fantastic remote update capability?

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#75

Post by chihuahua »

Nextgrid wrote: post #57
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #2

AEG consumer electronics are pure trash nowadays and have nothing to do with the OG AEG company. IIRC, it's a Chinese brand now who licensed the AEG brand name.

Are there still consumer white goods brands that aren't lowest-bidder Chinese crap? I've learned not to trust brand names anymore and just assume everything is crap and buy cheap stuff that I wouldn't mind replacing at the smallest problem.

Miele

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#76

Post by ggreg84 »

fatnoah wrote: post #30
DiabloD3 wrote: post #16

I refuse to own an oven that is internet connected. If my oven has enough of a computer to have a firmware that can be updated remotely, it is too dangerous to own.

I'm starting a kitchen upgrade, and the number of "connected" kitchen appliances is astonishing. I don't need my faucet to have Alexa, I don't want to read news on my refrigerator, and I don't want an app for my oven. I'm not aware of any companies keeping servers running for a product that matches the life expectancy of a kitchen appliance, nor do I want an AWS outage to keep me from making nachos.

Buy professional appliances, for restaurants.

For some reason, they are often better along many axes: cheaper, easier to clean, more customizable, more powerful, more flexible, etc.

I really like the professional induction stoves, with actual physical dials, no touch crap.

And the best part, there is a huge used market for professional appliances in really good shape, for even lower price.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#77

Post by Nextgrid »

jaywalk wrote: post #74
Nextgrid wrote: post #52

Why is there no user-facing firmware update/recovery feature, so that at least tech-savvy users can resolve the issue themselves? Or a reset feature that reverts to the factory firmware located on a separate, read-only chip? Ah yes, it's to prevent people downgrading or running "unauthorized" firmware when they inevitably start adding user-hostile "features".

It's probably more about cost savings than anything else. Why add a USB port and the associated functionality required to do manual updates when it's got a fantastic remote update capability?

It doesn't need extra hardware. Most routers have some rudimentary TFTP boot mode that can be accessed by powering it up while holding a certain button. The device already has Wi-Fi, so the same mechanism can be used - if powered up in recovery mode, it'll scan for a specific SSID and then TFTP boot from a specific IP on there.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#78

Post by switchbak »

ncr100 wrote: post #45
jaywalk wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My oven is Internet connected. It can't be turned on remotely unless I press a button on the oven itself, and even then it'll only allow it once. The WiFi functionality is also such total garbage that it'll only stay connected for a few days, and requires physically unplugging and re-plugging the power to the oven to get it to reconnect.

How did software engineering get to the point where this kind of low quality update is shipped "too often" for serious circumstances like a physical oven? Like it's hardly notable news anymore for something like this to happen. It's frequent. I worry that agile is largely responsible, and has mutated into a pipeline for garbage, though I don't have any evidence to confirm that suspicion.

Agile was in use for many years before this craziness started, I think you need another explanation.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#79

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

chihuahua wrote: post #75
Nextgrid wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there still consumer white goods brands that aren't lowest-bidder Chinese crap? I've learned not to trust brand names anymore and just assume everything is crap and buy cheap stuff that I wouldn't mind replacing at the smallest problem.

Miele

Yeah, but their pricing is just insane. Far out of the reach of the middle class, at least in Europe.

I would say Siemens and Bosch are solid while still being affordable.

Re: AEG combi microwave unusable after update: device thinks it is a steam oven

#80

Post by b112 »

gandalfian wrote: post #31
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #2

AEG consumer electronics are pure trash nowadays and have nothing to do with the OG AEG company. IIRC, it's a Chinese brand now who licensed the AEG brand name.

Owned by Electrolux. So in Europe at at least Electrolux, zanussi and AEG will be roughly similar parts aimed at different market segments. My AEG oven from a year ago was still made in Germany so hopefully ok. They may well ajbe sold the branding rights in some cases though.

I bet assembled, not made.
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