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5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

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Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#111

Post by ldoughty »

> You can start thinking now, aside from violence, what other plans are there? Huh? But in the end, violence would be fine too. Huh? Beat him [chuckles], beat him until he cannot run for election. Heh, that’s the-the last resort. You-you think about it. Car accident, [he] will be completely wrecked [chuckles], right? Don’t know, eh, whatever ways from all different angles. Or, on the day of the election, he cannot make it there himself, right?

Wow... If this person is indeed directed by the PRC, that's basically state-sponsored killing/maiming...

I'm sure other countries (including the USA) do it.. but it's wrong on so many levels....

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#112

Post by pessimizer »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #91
salt-thrower wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Moreover, it’s easy to criticize Cold War eta interventions when the stakes were very high Were they, though? Which nation was primarily responsible for escalation of tensions during that time? And for whom were the stakes high enough to justify overthrowing democratic governments in favor of brutal dictators?

I'm not defending any particular action, I'm cautioning against context-less comparisons. But to answer your other questions, the stakes were very high for the whole world (global thermonuclear war, communism, etc) and the USSR was primarily responsible for escalating though no doubt the west was not uniformly virtuous. If your goal is to compare the West or the US in particular with its dictatorial rivals, it's prob…

> the west was not uniformly virtuous.

So not absolutely perfect angels at all times? Harsh criticism.

The US started the thermonuclear arms race, and escalated it until it consumed a large part of the economy, based on literal calculated lies about the "missile gap."

> If your goal is to compare the West or the US in particular with its dictatorial rivals

The goal should be to point out its dictatorial tendencies, and its preference for predictable dictatorial regimes all over the world that it is willing to spend huge amounts of resources to install and preserve, bathing countries around the world in blood.

China is not doing that, Russia is not doing that, Iran is not doing that, North Korea is not doing that.

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#113

Post by CamperBob2 »

philovivero wrote: post #4

Sometimes I think this sounds conspiratorial, and surely isn't happening. Who has the time or money to pay 5 people to just go around harassing and stalking people for political gain only? Then I remember the story of the lady in East Germany who, after it fell, managed to get the Stasi records that finally proved that yes, they had been stalking her, harassing her, and spying on her. They would do things like wait u…

Also reminiscent of the batshit-bonkers story of eBay's corporate jihad against a mom-and-pop business:

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/06/ebay-execs-sent-...

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2021/07/lawsuit-ebay-tri...

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#114

Post by mrtksn »

ajsharp wrote: post #23

These details are wild, scary, and fascinating. Fascinating from the perspective of how easy it is for foreign governments on the other side of the world to try to scare the shit out of US citizens by hiring some scumbag PI for probably as little as $5k. > Beginning in September 2021, Lin hired a private investigator (the PI) in New York to disrupt the campaign of a Brooklyn resident currently running for U.S. Congre…

Back in college, I did a bit of "spying" for foreign companies. Nothing bad spirited, of course. They simply wanted me to photograph the entrance of the offices of local companies they partner with to see if the local company is at the address they claim to be.

It was a good pay for a very easy job.

However, considering that Kim Jong-un's brother was killed at the airport by making a civilian to spray neurotoxin on him under the pretext of a camera joke, I don't see why foreign entities wouldn't be able to hire unsuspecting citizens to do shady stuff(that can be plausibly explained as jobs).

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#115

Post by cjbgkagh »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #41
noobermin wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That reminds me of COINTELPRO, and how the FBI tried to get MLK to commit suicide by sending him a harassing black mailing letter. It's amazing how states particularly when they have apparatuses that can go rouge or are even actually encouraged by the government like the Stasi were go to ridiculous lengths to harass people they find politically inconvenient.

My favorite is the time the FBI sent a bunch of fake correspondence making it seem like a bunch of prominent civil rights leaders were cheating on their spouses and was very confused when nothing came of it because said spouses already assumed they were and didn't care.

My fav story along those lines is the KGB trying to blackmail Sukarno with videotape of dalliances with prostitutes. He asked for copies to show his friends.

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#116

Post by solveit »

pessimizer wrote: post #109
solveit wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bad actor claiming reasonable motivation does not make the motivation unreasonable... Obviously you have to also be sincere (debatable in Russia's case) and correct (Russian claims are simply wrong).

Russian claims of an interest in controlling the government of Ukraine are at least as legitimate as US claims of an interest in controlling Korea, or Afghanistan.

And is the Ukrainean state actually fascist? How about Korea? In the absence of UN intervention, would there have arisen an authoritarian state that was a menace to not only its own citizens but every neighbouring country?

Clearly Ukraine is not fascist and Korea would have been. There is a difference.

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#117

Post by reaperducer »

cwkoss wrote: post #108
freeflight wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FBI COINTELPRO [0] and CIA Operation CHAOS [1] did way more than just sending some harassing mail to MLK [2] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_CHAOS [2] https://openyls.law.yale.edu/bitstream/handle/20.500.13051/7...

Seems very odd that people are downvoting the comment I'm replying to: downvoters - why are you downvoting this? Do you think it's false? Or just don't like hearing about it?

I didn't downvote you, but often people get downvoted because they take the discussion off-topic.

It's interesting to you that what the PRC is doing today reminds you of something the FBI did last century. But the discussion is still about the PRC, not the FBI.

As you can see, your comment that is benign on the surface started a whole thread of off-topic comments, which bogs down the overall discussion and generates more heat than light.

Or maybe people read what you wrote as yet another "what about..." comment, the likes of which always pop up like mushrooms after a rain in discussions about China's current-day misdeeds.

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#119

Post by TechBro8615 »

reaperducer wrote: post #117
cwkoss wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems very odd that people are downvoting the comment I'm replying to: downvoters - why are you downvoting this? Do you think it's false? Or just don't like hearing about it?

I didn't downvote you, but often people get downvoted because they take the discussion off-topic. It's interesting to you that what the PRC is doing today reminds you of something the FBI did last century. But the discussion is still about the PRC, not the FBI. As you can see, your comment that is benign on the surface started a whole thread of off-topic comments, which bogs down the overall discussion and generates…

At this point we can't even talk conspiracy theories without someone bringing up the meta conspiracy theories, like the Chinese saboteurs sowing division in this comment section...

Re: 5 Charged with Stalking, Harassing, Spying on US Residents for PRC Secret Police

#120

Post by null0pointer »

qwertyuiop_ wrote: post #6

No other country has managed to accomplish what CCP has in its coordinated campaign across the globe. Covert: Inflitrate US Congress for potential blackmail - https://www.axios.com/china-spy-california-politicians-9d2df... Infitration of US Higher Ed & Supression - https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/01/16/how-china... Siphon off entire US Government personnel information, Probably to match it against Grindr…

> No other country has managed to accomplish what CCP has in its coordinated campaign across the globe.

How would you know? Maybe others just haven't been caught yet. It would be naive to think that China is the only country doing, or attempting to do, this.

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