25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance • Hacker News Board

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#61

Post by jjmaxwell4 » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:03 PM UTC

bocmaxima wrote: post #27

kapilkale wrote: post #4

I don't regret going to management consulting after college. In my opinion, it's the best possible career choice for people who don't know what they want to do. In my time in consulting, I was exposed to people in every corporate function possible, and had the chance to see what their jobs were like. I worked for tech companies, PE firms, corporations, and government-regulated entities. I spent 6 months in growth equ…

FB and Amazon turned out just fine without your help, the only reason you wish you had worked there was in order to extract and benefit from the great pool of wealth and prestige. Your value to society is nil for as long as you spend more mental energy consuming more than you create. Remember that all highly educated people bear a responsibility much greater than ourselves, and this responsibility is fulfilled only b…

> this responsibility is fulfilled only by sacrifice and discomfort.

The highly educated do not owe society anything. No one should have a right to my intelligence. If I want to contribute, I can and will, and if I'm smart enough and execute well enough, I will be rewarded, both monetarily and through watching my creation create real value.

This does not mean that sacrifice and discomfort are the only ways to create value. Wile start ups are roller coasters of emotion, I can bet you that Jobs, Gates, Page et al. Have gleaned much more pleasure from their creations then sacrifice, discomfort and pain.

And the only person who can make them do anything is themselves. Larry and Sergey did not bear a responsibility from society to create Google. They did by their own choice.

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#62

Post by dlokshin » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:17 PM UTC

david927 wrote: post #43

rayiner wrote: post #16

I mean, if you had the opportunity to earn six figures at graduation, wouldn't you go into these fields too? 75% of Yalies are normal people (the other 25% come from money). They're the children of working professionals, federal government employees, etc. They have had comfortable upbringings, but their families don't have "fuck you" money. They've been pushed and prodded all their life by parents who, like everyone…

I imagine the question isn't, "Why are they going into this lucrative industry?" as much as it is, "why is this industry so exceptionally lucrative?" To me, the financial industry looks like every other bubble right before the pop with everyone trying to pile in to the money machine, but any close examination of the machine reveals an empty ruse. Maybe you're right and they were pushed into it. But it's short-term th…

Consulting and finance are lucrative, partially because there are serious demands of the job that you're not considering.

* Working 7 days a week (in the office for 110 hours) * Living out of a suitcase * Often living out of a suitcase in the middle of nowhere * Virtually no vacation * Expectation that you'll forfeit a vacation if the firm needs you * A lot of stress

And that's just the start of it. Plenty of people burn out and decide that the paycheck isn't worth it. Imagine that. You're making the mistake of only looking at the glamorous part of the job (the pay check) instead of actually taking a look at what the job entails.

Spoken from personal experience

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#63

Post by scottkduncan » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:22 PM UTC

bane wrote: post #53

david927 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine the question isn't, "Why are they going into this lucrative industry?" as much as it is, "why is this industry so exceptionally lucrative?" To me, the financial industry looks like every other bubble right before the pop with everyone trying to pile in to the money machine, but any close examination of the machine reveals an empty ruse. Maybe you're right and they were pushed into it. But it's short-term th…

"To me, the financial industry looks like every other bubble right before the pop with everyone trying to pile in to the money machine, but any close examination of the machine reveals an empty ruse." And I don't think I've ever heard a kind word about management consultants. A field dominated by 20 somethings with 0 professional work experience brought in to tell executives and managers of highly successful multi-mi…

I think there's another reason related to your a) and b) why companies hire management consultants, particularly in less dire corporate situations than you describe above. I think a lot of management consultants' work comes from boards or division managers who have a difficult decision they know they want to make (fire workers, spin off less successful business units), but need an "impartial" "expert" to agree with them to help justify it. The company asks only the questions they want the consulting company to consider, they get the answers they want, and they have an "independent" (and expensive) second opinion that covers them so they can go ahead with what they knew they would do in the first place.

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#64

Post by tomjen3 » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:34 PM UTC

jbooth wrote: post #54

tomjen3 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No we don't bear any responsibility to others. We worked for were we are and shouldn't be burdened with losers.

Yeah, good thing that you built those roads you drove to work on this morning. And that you had the foresight to hire those elementary school teachers to teach you math.

Yeah and stick me with a bunch of bullies (hey I consider myself lucky, the fuckers sent my brother to the hospital) whom I now have the honor of working my ass of so that the government can confiscate it so that they can get some food on the table because they are too stupid to make something of themselves.

And I will never see any justice for it, because the law in this country protect the guilty, rather than the innocent.

Yes I properly learned a lot in school and it made certain subjects such as physics and chemistry which required a lab easier. But don't think for a moment that the school was the reason I learned to read or write. I would have done that one my own anyway as I am too much a sucker for good stories.

As for the roads, people went to school before there were roads (paved ones anyway) they made it easier sure, but that is about it.

In summary I don't mind helping those who have tried and failed but I absolutely recent having to feel sorry and repent that I was born the way I was. And most people just need to apply themselves.

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#65

Post by stephenhuey » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:45 PM UTC

abrimo wrote: post #60

gizmo wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are so advantaged compared to the rest of humanity it isn't even funny. We have opportunities other people would kill for. We are in a position where we can make a meaningful positive contribution to the world. To throw that all away would be a huge waste. You don't have to sacrifice personal happiness, but yes, if you're in a position where you can do good and if you then choose not to do good I do consider that…

I completely agree. Although it might seem like we work hard and are fairly rewarded, the fact we have the skills and opportunities that we do is through no doing of our own. President Kennedy gave a great speech about the role and responsibilities of educated people in society. 'Increased responsibility goes with increased ability, for "of those to whom much is given, much is required."' http://www.jfklibrary.org/As…

Kennedy was quoting Luke 12:48 in the Bible:

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+12&vers...

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#66

Post by danssig » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:52 PM UTC

turing wrote: post #13

I was actually discussing this with a fellow Yale student over dinner tonight. We both came to the same, largely negative, conclusion as the professors interviewed in the article: "it’s an unproductive use of Yalies’ time." These students are given opportunities most people only dream of. We are exposed to leaders in our fields every day. We are blessed with a $20 billion endowment that enables nearly anything we can…

What do you expect? There is no such thing as "secure job" anymore so the only way to secure your lifestyle is to make as much money as possible.

I would love to make things that benefit everyone and give them away for free but there's no way I'm going to do that while my family needs my productive hours to generate income.

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#67

Post by Hyena » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 2:58 PM UTC

dlokshin wrote: post #62

david927 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine the question isn't, "Why are they going into this lucrative industry?" as much as it is, "why is this industry so exceptionally lucrative?" To me, the financial industry looks like every other bubble right before the pop with everyone trying to pile in to the money machine, but any close examination of the machine reveals an empty ruse. Maybe you're right and they were pushed into it. But it's short-term th…

Consulting and finance are lucrative, partially because there are serious demands of the job that you're not considering. * Working 7 days a week (in the office for 110 hours) * Living out of a suitcase * Often living out of a suitcase in the middle of nowhere * Virtually no vacation * Expectation that you'll forfeit a vacation if the firm needs you * A lot of stress And that's just the start of it. Plenty of people…

The difficulty or inconvenience of a job does not really imply additional remuneration. If it did, migrant farmworkers would probably be the richest people in the world.

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#68

Post by jbooth » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 3:10 PM UTC

tomjen3 wrote: post #64

jbooth wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, good thing that you built those roads you drove to work on this morning. And that you had the foresight to hire those elementary school teachers to teach you math.

Yeah and stick me with a bunch of bullies (hey I consider myself lucky, the fuckers sent my brother to the hospital) whom I now have the honor of working my ass of so that the government can confiscate it so that they can get some food on the table because they are too stupid to make something of themselves. And I will never see any justice for it, because the law in this country protect the guilty, rather than the i…

This is pretty far off topic now, but I'd suggest dropping the resentment for the bullies, you'll have a more fulfilling life and make better decisions and observations. (Like, for example, very little government money goes to welfare).

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#69

Post by gizmo » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 3:14 PM UTC

stephenhuey wrote: post #65

abrimo wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree. Although it might seem like we work hard and are fairly rewarded, the fact we have the skills and opportunities that we do is through no doing of our own. President Kennedy gave a great speech about the role and responsibilities of educated people in society. 'Increased responsibility goes with increased ability, for "of those to whom much is given, much is required."' http://www.jfklibrary.org/As…

Kennedy was quoting Luke 12:48 in the Bible: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+12&vers...

And the bible in turn paraphrased Spiderman: "with great power comes great responsibility."

Re: 25% of Yale goes to Consulting, Finance

#70

Post by mchusma » Mon, Oct 03, 2011, 3:17 PM UTC

Hyena wrote: post #67

dlokshin wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consulting and finance are lucrative, partially because there are serious demands of the job that you're not considering. * Working 7 days a week (in the office for 110 hours) * Living out of a suitcase * Often living out of a suitcase in the middle of nowhere * Virtually no vacation * Expectation that you'll forfeit a vacation if the firm needs you * A lot of stress And that's just the start of it. Plenty of people…

The difficulty or inconvenience of a job does not really imply additional remuneration. If it did, migrant farmworkers would probably be the richest people in the world.

The difficulty does not, but pay is only one form of compensation. Those with the most opportunity have many good options, some with more pay, and some with better work conditions. in other words, if you need a smart person you need to compel them to work for you.