Very disappointing. Search is about finding things, not about narrating things.
DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
641–650 of 865 posts
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#642Earlier quoted context omitted.
You have rediscovered why it is difficult to make a search engine. This is a problem that applies to all search results, not just politically charged content: human judgement is always required to write a search algorithm.
So where does that leave us? Everything is biased? What does that mean when applied to duckduckgo's tweet from 2019? It's just a hollow slogan? I'm not sure that changes the conclusion much. The first impression I got from reading the comment was that the tweet from 2019 was a hollow PR message that they don't stand behind.
You should check out Algorithms of Oppression, a very good book about the exact topic you’re asking questions about.
Short answer yes, if humans are involved in making something it’s going to be subjected to the biases of those humans.
https://nyupress.org/9781479837243/algorithms-of-oppression/
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#643Perhaps DDG could tell us what their sources of information are, that they are able to discern what is disinformation.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#644Earlier quoted context omitted.
"unbiased" doesn't mean "unfiltered". For example, I don't want spam or malware in my search results. Search results should return good information that is relevant to your query, and filter out anything that is not that.
"Good information" is very subjective. Some people think Fox News information is good, others think it's all lies. Some people think Wikipedia is the closest thing to Word of God that we can get, others think it's a bunch of kids with too much free time on their hands writing about things they have no idea about. Some people think the US government is trustworthy, others think it lied so many times only an idiot can…
Truth, because different people have different axioms or goals, might be subjective. I don't think this relates to quality of information.
A higher quality information media will give you the tools to get more information, and this is for example where wikipedia shines by requiring citations. Even if some piece of information there is wrong, you usually get the tools to obtain more information, and you get a summary (where they do attempt to stay neutral) of multiple positions when there is no consensus.
Quality of information is not precisely equals to truth, some questions to ask of any information relay: - Do they give you the sources for their information ? - Do they make a good faith attempt to stay neutral ? - If not staying neutral, do they make their position and conflicts of interest clear ? - Do they provide adequate (non-strawmen) summaries of opposing views ? - What is their process for correcting information ?
Of course wikipedia isn't perfect, but it is a higher than average quality of information on the internet. You should use wikipedia (or any source really) as an authoritative source (something isn't tree just because it is written their), but it is an excellent starting point. As most other good sources of information are.
You can't easily judge the veracity of any piece of information on any platform, but you can more easily judge a good faith attempt at providing you the tools to obtain further information.
No platform is going to be perfect, but these criteria should help anyone to filter out bad news sources, and it should not be impossible to convince most people that these are good criteria.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#645Prior submission: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30624320 Brave Search has been gradually improving and I'm pleased with the quality of their results as of late. I encourage folks to give it a spin.
You might want to give Kagi a try. I've been using it for a few weeks and I think it's better than Google for my needs.
Unfortunately also seems US based, and at this point I'm not ready to put any long term trust in US based companies remaining unbiased.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#646Earlier quoted context omitted.
search rt.com Now blocked in several countries.
Really? https://duckduckgo.com/?q=rt&ia=web Works fine for me in the US. RT.com is the first result. What countries are you referring to? And is this DDG’s decision or are they being forced to comply with the country’s law?
I was mainly referring to the EUs ban on RT. I think the law forces the ISPs to comply, not the engines. that way it prevents direct access via the URL.
https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2022/03/08/eu-officials-d...
RT is not banned in the US as far as I know, although it appears engines are banning some content of their own free will.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#647Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm reminded a little bit of a clip[0] in which an AP reporter challenged a State Department official about some of his claims about the Russian plans for a war on Ukraine. It's aged in a weird way, because of course, the war happened - but it does show the weird dynamic at play between journalists, the people, and the state security apparatus. Essentially, they can't give you the details. Sometimes they lie, for nat…
Did Russia ever stage a false flag operation before their invasion of Ukraine? I don't recall hearing about it.
Depends what exactly you mean by "false flag operation". But South Ossetia seemed to follow much the same playbook as Ukraine.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#648Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think you're framing the discussion in the wrong way. Yes, if you're looking for "Russian Disinformation", you should be able to find it. But if I'm looking for "U.S. midterm elections", I shouldn't get Russian disinformation. What is the problem with modifying the algorithm to favor actual information over disinformation? Or sites that are known to propagate disinformation? The only thing I could say is that it's…
The problem is not "U.S. midterm elections" but "Ukraine invasion 2022". Part of the problem is that defining "relevance" is hard, and quickly descends into gray areas and morality. Russian disinformation about Ukraine is relevant in that it actually is content about the Ukraine invasion in 2022. But it's not relevant in that it's not facts about the Ukraine invasion in 2022. Maybe there should be a button that lets…
Ultimately isn’t “disinformation” control exactly the problem? There are abundant examples of disinformation just being information that was 24-96 hours ahead of the news cycle (sometimes 6-9 months).
DDG has now decided that they are editors because their perspective is “correct”, but on what authority?
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#649Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I simply can't trust ANY media, search engine, or social network anymore. It's one of the key goals of Russian information warfare: to create a feeling that you can't tell truth apart from fiction, and to force you into apathy and paralyze you, so you become unable to act and protect your interests. Russians are among the largest pushers of conspiracy theories from Covid to QAnon, and have been for a very long time…
“ It's one of the key goals of Russian information warfare” were you born yesterday? do you not remember the iraq war? babies in incubators? vietnam? syrian gas attacks? russiagate? qanon? the 2014 ukraine coup? these are all things created by western TLAs. im not gonna read anything else you wrote but i noticed at the bottom you said “knowledge is power” wow thanks for that powerful insight!
Except for Fox News, which breathlessly covered every new possible chemical weapons facility that the US captured, mainstream media pretty quickly concluded that there was no extant chemical weapons program in Iraq after the US entered. Russian media is still pretending that Ukraine is the aggressor, and there is no war.
Re: DuckDuckGo “down-rank sites associated with Russian disinformation”
#650Earlier quoted context omitted.
This whole Ukraine war teached me a thing I haven't noticed before: I simply can't trust ANY media, search engine, or social network anymore. It's a sad state of affairs, but since the invasion started my only source of "news" related to the war is a few, and I a said a FEW, Youtube channels. I'm brazilian and one channel I recommend is Fernando Ulrich's channel. He interviewed (in english) a lot people (ukrainians,…
I replaced mainstream media with Breaking Points ( https://www.youtube.com/c/breakingpoints ). I've found them to be far more reliable.
A fellow breaker! :) My go-to news source for context and perspective.