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Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

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Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#71

Post by cheeseomlit »

Nowado wrote: post #69
cheeseomlit wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but those trading cards are worth big bucks nowadays. Lootbox rewards are basically worthless since you don't really "own" them and cant resell them

You mean, the issue with child gambling these days is that there's no promise of a big pay out?

The gambling part is no good in either case. But there is a difference between buying a toy/collectible and actually owning it vs. this digital skinner box stuff where all you really get is a hit of dopamine, the latter seems more insidious to me

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#72

Post by [deleted] »

cheeseomlit wrote: post #71
Nowado wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean, the issue with child gambling these days is that there's no promise of a big pay out?

The gambling part is no good in either case. But there is a difference between buying a toy/collectible and actually owning it vs. this digital skinner box stuff where all you really get is a hit of dopamine, the latter seems more insidious to me

[deleted]

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#73

Post by Kiro »

cheeseomlit wrote: post #65
mFixman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure my parents would disagree that Pokémon trading cards weren't a giant money sink designed to take their money. I can see a lot of problems with giving children access to credit cards, but I honestly fail to see how loot boxes are different from trading cards marketed to children. My high school enacted and enforced a ban on all card and board games because some parents were worried about child gambling; I'm s…

True, but those trading cards are worth big bucks nowadays. Lootbox rewards are basically worthless since you don't really "own" them and cant resell them

So you're basically arguing for NFTs?

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#74

Post by Bombthecat »

cheeseomlit wrote: post #65
mFixman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure my parents would disagree that Pokémon trading cards weren't a giant money sink designed to take their money. I can see a lot of problems with giving children access to credit cards, but I honestly fail to see how loot boxes are different from trading cards marketed to children. My high school enacted and enforced a ban on all card and board games because some parents were worried about child gambling; I'm s…

True, but those trading cards are worth big bucks nowadays. Lootbox rewards are basically worthless since you don't really "own" them and cant resell them

And every year, they become useless. I still don't get why people spent so much money... Every year..

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#75

Post by jmyeet »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #4
jmyeet wrote: post #3

This makes me sad. I think loot boxes with RNG rewards are a disgusting practice. It's gambling that minors are allowed to do. One of the things I respect Epic Games for is they didn't follow this profitable path for Fortnite. In Fortnite, you want the skin, you buy the skin. You don't buy a ton of boxes and hope to get lucky. Gambling with an immediate result is bad. It's particularly bad for children. But it's also…

Fortnite is its own evil. They only show an extremely small fraction of the items available each day, with no indication of whether they'll return, so that you feel you have to buy things now in case you never have the chance again.

I think this argument is a stretch for two reasons:

1. Anyone who sells anything has limited runs, sales and so forth. Like that's just commerce; and

2. Loot box games do all the same thing anyway so at least on Fortnite you know the cost of what you want.

This is one of these situations where Fortnite is strictly better than RNG loot boxes. That's not the same as saying they do no wrong. But better? Objectively, yes.

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#76

Post by kojeovo »

cheeseomlit wrote: post #65
mFixman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure my parents would disagree that Pokémon trading cards weren't a giant money sink designed to take their money. I can see a lot of problems with giving children access to credit cards, but I honestly fail to see how loot boxes are different from trading cards marketed to children. My high school enacted and enforced a ban on all card and board games because some parents were worried about child gambling; I'm s…

True, but those trading cards are worth big bucks nowadays. Lootbox rewards are basically worthless since you don't really "own" them and cant resell them

It's really only some first gen holo mint cards that are worth decent money. That's gotta be a tiny, tiny percentage.

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#77

Post by [deleted] »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #4
jmyeet wrote: post #3

This makes me sad. I think loot boxes with RNG rewards are a disgusting practice. It's gambling that minors are allowed to do. One of the things I respect Epic Games for is they didn't follow this profitable path for Fortnite. In Fortnite, you want the skin, you buy the skin. You don't buy a ton of boxes and hope to get lucky. Gambling with an immediate result is bad. It's particularly bad for children. But it's also…

Fortnite is its own evil. They only show an extremely small fraction of the items available each day, with no indication of whether they'll return, so that you feel you have to buy things now in case you never have the chance again.

[deleted]

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#78

Post by MaxBarraclough »

jafoi wrote: post #70

Good. The government does not have a right to restrict trade between citizens and companies. On the other hand, it's the parents' job to decide what their children can and can't do.

> The government does not have a right to restrict trade between citizens and companies.

Of course it does, as a matter of category.

The government makes it illegal for you to buy grenades, for instance.

Re: Lootboxes in FIFA now allowed by highest Dutch court

#80

Post by mFixman »

BrS96bVxXBLzf5B wrote: post #48
mFixman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure my parents would disagree that Pokémon trading cards weren't a giant money sink designed to take their money. I can see a lot of problems with giving children access to credit cards, but I honestly fail to see how loot boxes are different from trading cards marketed to children. My high school enacted and enforced a ban on all card and board games because some parents were worried about child gambling; I'm s…

This definitely isn't a universal experience and there are definitely a lot of trading card horror stories, but for me + friends growing up the purchase of trading cards had a different place in life. They were like one of life's small rewards you had a chance of rolling whenever going into a shop with a parent/guardian. Being at the checkout, putting on the little kid puppy-dog 'pleaseeeeeee' and the adult deciding…

Did we have different childhoods, or do you not really forget yours?

Children used to steal trading cards and have violent fights over them. Only a few dedicated nerds played the game; the rest just collected the cards and showed them as a proxy of self-worth.

This is perfectly normal child behaviour, and I'm sure it was much worse than whatever's happening right now with lootboxes. The main difference between them isn't the lack car rides to the store; it's the moral panic mostly distributed by social media about how $fun_thing is killing children.

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