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Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

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Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#21
post #14

This doesn’t seem any more cowardly than YouTube’s decision to ban RT. Hard to claim to be on the side of free speech when American tech companies are censoring right and left.

RT propaganda is an organic part, a psyop, of the genocidal war in Ukraine. There is nothing about free speech in refusal to support genocidal war. If anything it is a duty of any normal person (and any company consisting of such people).

This isn’t a “genocidal” war.

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#22
post #16

There is nothing bold about halting trade with Russia right now; as far as can be told there is a great deal of social and political support for anyone making such a choice. To be honest, companies making emotional decisions is more concerning to me. It is reasonable and to be encouraged if businesses want to be a moral-less dumb pipe. Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a…

> Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a just war or propaganda

how hard it is? when only one of the 2 sides bombs civilians and causes millions of people to run away (as of now 1.4M, mostly women/children/elderly, have already crossed the border while many more is still running toward the border) just for the reason of ethnical difference, and thus committing genocide and ethnic cleansing.

Edit in response to comment below:

>No one had ever mentioned Ukrainians being "discriminated" by Russians before the war

well, sounds like you are completely unfamiliar with history there. I'm btw a Russian, half-Ukrainian, and your lecture here on that national issue is just fully incorrect.

>This is a desperate attempt by some Ukrainians to paint a picture of Russia as being equivalent to Nazi Germany, playing the same Hitler card that Putin did to start the war.

that is just Russian propaganda, and completely unsupported by any facts.

>They are doing that to try to make the West feel morally obliged to act even if that means war spreads to the whole of Europe and potentially, turns into a nuclear war.

that again is Russian propaganda, trying to scare the West by nukes.

>Even though there is a lot of suffering happening in Ukraine

the suffering has ethnical reason and thus it is genocide

> and Russia is indeed bombing cities in the fight with the Ukrainian army

that it Russian propaganda. Russia is bombing cities without any connection to any fight. Just look at all those aftermath videos - there is no Ukrainian tanks/etc among the destroyed buildings/etc. For example, today they shot down a pilot bombing a city and interviewed him - "They told us the city was empty", and of course he lied as it was a guy well known for his Syrian civilian bombings. He didn't even try to say anything about any military targets.

On the other side there are tons of videos of Russian armor burnt in the cities. Why did they come into cities endangering the civilians?

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#23
post #11

So now we are beyond "praise a company if they shut their business in Russia", and have arrived at "ostracize them if they don't", even though (afaik) they haven't been ordered to censor their content or otherwise be a mouthpiece for them? Is there an extreme to this or is it all going to pass public judgement?

I run over 300 forums. These are based in Europe, America, Australia. They are for varied interests from cycling to cars to telescopes.

There are threads about the war on every forum.

And individuals on every forum are actively cancelling subscriptions and tracking boycotts.

It's not just going to pass public judgement, it has enthusiastic and vocal support of most of the public.

This anecdata is based on a monthly user base of 250k. Not significant, but also not insignificant.

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#24
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RT propaganda is an organic part, a psyop, of the genocidal war in Ukraine. There is nothing about free speech in refusal to support genocidal war. If anything it is a duty of any normal person (and any company consisting of such people).

This isn’t a “genocidal” war.

Civilians are intentionally killed and forced from their land because they are of different ethnicity. That is called genocide and ethnic cleansing. Putin has been very clear in his speeches that "Ukrainian question" is the main issue here. Ukrainians being of different ethnicity want their own culture, state, etc. while Putin refuses their right for that on the basis of his claim that their ethnicity doesn't exist.

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#25
As an R. Kelly fan, this does not surprise me all. Once censorship begins it’s easier and easier to follow that well worn path. A lot of people like to mock the idea of cancel culture and pretend that it doesn’t exist - you know, the plainly disingenuous types who will say “they are a private company” out of one side of their mouth while demanding gay wedding cakes get baked out of the other. And sure there are ostensible shallow moral victories to be enjoyed by shutting your enemies up. But this impulse to control what’s said and what’s heard in the public sphere sure seems more dangerous when the stakes are higher, and increasingly it isn’t just normalized, but encouraged.

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#26
post #16

There is nothing bold about halting trade with Russia right now; as far as can be told there is a great deal of social and political support for anyone making such a choice. To be honest, companies making emotional decisions is more concerning to me. It is reasonable and to be encouraged if businesses want to be a moral-less dumb pipe. Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a…

How is it that you think a corporation is not capable of making geopolitical judgments? You don't think they have a PR department? You don't think they have leadership that can read the news?

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#27
post #22
post #16

There is nothing bold about halting trade with Russia right now; as far as can be told there is a great deal of social and political support for anyone making such a choice. To be honest, companies making emotional decisions is more concerning to me. It is reasonable and to be encouraged if businesses want to be a moral-less dumb pipe. Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a…

> Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a just war or propaganda how hard it is? when only one of the 2 sides bombs civilians and causes millions of people to run away (as of now 1.4M, mostly women/children/elderly, have already crossed the border while many more is still running toward the border) just for the reason of ethnical difference, and thus committing genocide and e…

[flagged]

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#28
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t a “genocidal” war.

Civilians are intentionally killed and forced from their land because they are of different ethnicity. That is called genocide and ethnic cleansing. Putin has been very clear in his speeches that "Ukrainian question" is the main issue here. Ukrainians being of different ethnicity want their own culture, state, etc. while Putin refuses their right for that on the basis of his claim that their ethnicity doesn't exist.

> because they are of a different ethnicity

[citation needed]

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#29
post #26
post #16

There is nothing bold about halting trade with Russia right now; as far as can be told there is a great deal of social and political support for anyone making such a choice. To be honest, companies making emotional decisions is more concerning to me. It is reasonable and to be encouraged if businesses want to be a moral-less dumb pipe. Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a…

How is it that you think a corporation is not capable of making geopolitical judgments? You don't think they have a PR department? You don't think they have leadership that can read the news?

“Reading the news” hardly gives you the ability to make geopolitical judgments.

Re: Spotify made a cowardly choice: to submit to the Kremlin

#30
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Spotify is not equipped to make geopolitical judgements about what is and isn't a just war or propaganda how hard it is? when only one of the 2 sides bombs civilians and causes millions of people to run away (as of now 1.4M, mostly women/children/elderly, have already crossed the border while many more is still running toward the border) just for the reason of ethnical difference, and thus committing genocide and e…

[flagged]

> russians protecting their interests against american advances

that is Russian propaganda to misdirect attention. How the genocide and ethnic cleansing solves american advances? Putin hates Ukrainians. If you listen to his speech the hate and contempt are palpable.

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