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Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

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Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#181

Post by erosenbe0 »

JohnBooty wrote: post #84
threeseed wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin is 69 in a country where average age at death is 73. So the most likely scenario is that the status quo remains until he passes away. At which point there would be an opportunity for a clean reset in relations.

That doesn't mean he has a 50% chance of dying in 4 years. That avg expectancy of 73 includes all the people that die young, etc. "Actuarial tables" is the term you're looking for, if you're curious how long a particular person at a particular age might live. https://www.ssa.gov/oact/STATS/table4c6.html In the US a person who is currently 69 years old will live, on average, for another 17.53 years. In Russia the aver…

He is a man so it is 15.x years from 69 not 17.x years. But he is a short man which in some studies tends to make up a lot of the difference. Short people live longer.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#182

Post by Aeolun »

pvaldes wrote: post #83

An Mango, H&M and many other. They say that foreign companies operating in Russia were required by the Putin's government to change their euros for rubles in three days if they want to stand open. Closing is the logical choice.

So all the companies collectively shrugged their shoulders and said “Ok, bye.”

I really don’t know what he was going for here.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#183

Post by [deleted] »

twelve40 wrote: post #176
smcl wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're certainly not, but they're the biggest and the Russian airlines already own or lease a lot of Boeing and Airbus planes. Aeroflot is nearly all Airbus[0] and Rossiya[1] (largest operator of Russian-made Sukhoi planes) is around half Airbus, half Sukhoi. They could indeed just scrap these and buy a shiny new fleet of, say, Embraer jets but that would involve retraining pilots and support staff, not to mention a…

Just like Embraer would have a ton of trouble delivering a 500 plane replacement, think about what would it take to return 500 leased planes (and for the leasing companies to lease them to someone else to avoid going bankrupt, and for Boeing to deal with a deluge of cheap second-hand planes, etc etc). Even if all 500 planes are instantly returned at the end of March (how?), there will be reduced traffic to Europe due…

[deleted]

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#184

Post by b3kart »

greendesk wrote: post #171
b3kart wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am conflicted about this. On one hand, people’s livelihoods are at stake, and one can argue some news is better than no news. On the other hand, by continuing reporting on events unrelated to war, are we not helping Putin’s regime to push the “it’s all fine, don’t worry about the war” agenda?

You go to jail for any reporting related to the war in Russia. No exceptions. One way to check is go to to a news aggregator, like news.Google.com, choose Russian region for Russian related news. Use a translate service to get a view what information is shared. I have done it out of a habit - and the level of control is extreme that no useful information is shared.

I know. But not reporting _anything_ is not unlawful, and seems more honest than playing along with government’s rules. At least then it’s clear that Russia has no independent media. The way I see it is a newspaper in Nazi Germany deciding to focus on the economy, because they can’t report on concentration camps. Better than nothing, maybe, but works great for distracting people from genocide. Again, I understand it’s people’s livelihoods, so I don’t want to judge them too harshly.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#185

Post by pydry »

jl6 wrote: post #69
nuccy wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People from the west may say: well yes, our media is biased also. And that is true, but direction of this bias is different for each media outlet, so by watching something else you can find discrepancies and inconsistencies. While in Russia all tv, radio, newspapers are government controlled, so they put the same fake and propaganda which due to lack of anything else (all blocked) yields brain washing on a whole coun…

Western media bias works by using selective reporting and omission, plus artful mixing of fact and opinion. It doesn’t too often make up outright bare-faced lies like we see coming from the Russian government.

On this topic I can think of two that I'm seeing on a regular basis.

1. NATO is solely a defensive organization. Libya is the clearest counterexample but there others.

2. NATO never gave assurances it wouldnt move east. There are a number of recently released diplomatic caches that prove this to be false https://larouchepub.com/other/2021/4824-chatham_house_lies_a...

https://news.antiwar.com/2022/02/21/uncovered-document-revea...

2 is sometimes done selectively (by saying NATO never gave legal guarantees) but sometimes not.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#186

Post by mushbino »

jl6 wrote: post #69
nuccy wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People from the west may say: well yes, our media is biased also. And that is true, but direction of this bias is different for each media outlet, so by watching something else you can find discrepancies and inconsistencies. While in Russia all tv, radio, newspapers are government controlled, so they put the same fake and propaganda which due to lack of anything else (all blocked) yields brain washing on a whole coun…

Western media bias works by using selective reporting and omission, plus artful mixing of fact and opinion. It doesn’t too often make up outright bare-faced lies like we see coming from the Russian government.

Exactly. The news doesn't lie to me about the wealthy dodging taxes, but they sure don't report on it. There are also lots of technical truths, but heavily spun.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#187

Post by everfrustrated »

satellite2 wrote: post #135
nuccy wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People from the west may say: well yes, our media is biased also. And that is true, but direction of this bias is different for each media outlet, so by watching something else you can find discrepancies and inconsistencies. While in Russia all tv, radio, newspapers are government controlled, so they put the same fake and propaganda which due to lack of anything else (all blocked) yields brain washing on a whole coun…

It depends on the subject. Try to find a western media that defend the point of view of the Talibans for instance. Or their history and significance to the population for instance. Even in the most niche papers you won't find that. There will always be a line on their barbarian and anti democratic aspect. And that's why western medias didn't get that the US lost the war because the Talibans always had the backing of…

Sure but representing the biases of their own reporters/population is very different than representing a censorship board run by a government.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#188

Post by b3kart »

Klaster_1 wrote: post #153
b3kart wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am conflicted about this. On one hand, people’s livelihoods are at stake, and one can argue some news is better than no news. On the other hand, by continuing reporting on events unrelated to war, are we not helping Putin’s regime to push the “it’s all fine, don’t worry about the war” agenda?

The point is, Novaya will absolutely find a way to report about the rapidly declining situation in a manner barely acceptable by dumb censors. It's chief editor didn't get his peace Noble for nothing.

Not so sure on “absolutely”. Echo Moscow was riding this sharp line through thick and thin for 30 years, and even they had to close up shop yesterday.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#189

Post by erosenbe0 »

deniska wrote: post #30
threeseed wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin is 69 in a country where average age at death is 73. So the most likely scenario is that the status quo remains until he passes away. At which point there would be an opportunity for a clean reset in relations.

Gorbachev is 91 and still alive.

Jimmy Carter is 97. Kissinger is 98. All three won Nobel Peace Prizes. Is that the key to longevity? Because Putin will not be joining that club.

Re: Last Day of IKEA in Moscow

#190

Post by yk »

nuccy wrote: post #56
nuccy wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was also surprised by this. I find it absolutely crazy. The reason is that just few days ago the parliament of Russia introduced a law on "fakes about Russian army" with 15 years in prison penalty. What is "fake" is not defined so anyone for any statement about the war could be put in prison. Ah yes, people are also forbidden to call this a war, an agression or an invasion. You may say that there are other outlets…

People from the west may say: well yes, our media is biased also. And that is true, but direction of this bias is different for each media outlet, so by watching something else you can find discrepancies and inconsistencies. While in Russia all tv, radio, newspapers are government controlled, so they put the same fake and propaganda which due to lack of anything else (all blocked) yields brain washing on a whole coun…

There are also a lot of systematic biases in western media, first of all they all write that the west is really, really great. If they don't write that, and only write that the west is really great, then their readers will look for a publication that uses an appropriate number of "really" when telling their readers that the west, and by extension the presumably western reader, is great.
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