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Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

universityofcalifornia.edu

371–380 of 464 posts

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#371
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.news-medical.net/health/Oils-Rich-in-Linoleic-Ac... Look, if we're going to make major life changes on the basis of this one study, you've missed the opportunity for an all-chocolate diet.

*Cacao butter diet. Not the delightful as the candy bars but still just as possible.

You'd just throw out the cacao solids? Animal.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#372
post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> use the term "broiling" for shallow/pan-frying. Unusual word here. I don't think that's right; it's more used for what you do in the oven under the "broil" setting. Americans use "saute" and "fry" in somewhat context dependent , somewhat interchangeable ways. Along with "sear" being somewhat specific to browning at high heat.

Speaking as an American... I was aware that "broiling" was a cooking method, but I have no concept of what it involves. After checking a dictionary, I still don't -- wikipedia redirects "broiling" to "grilling", and Merriam-Webster defines "broil" as "to cook by direct exposure to radiant heat: grill", with an example given of "broil the steak in the oven". I would be more likely to use "bake" for heating something i…

Oh, I agree lots of American's don't use the word broil; I was (obviously not clearly) trying to say that those who do use it probably use it because there oven has a setting marked "broil". For ovens that have that, it usually means heat only using the top element (and sometimes only full blast), so the heat is only coming from above.

I think fry is more often used than saute, and often context dependent (e.g. fried chicken may imply deep fried, fried onions doesn't) This latter may be regional.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#373
post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Trying to avoid them is like trying to avoid endocrine disruptors by not touching plastic or eating anything that has touched plastic. Is there any evidence that something transfers to you if you do touch it? This is the first I am hearing about something like this. I thought plastic was essentially a solid. I have been interested in converting much of my daily interaction of plastic to other materials. Things like…

>Is there any evidence that something transfers to you if you do touch it? This is the first I am haring about something like this. I thought plastic was essentially a solid. I recall a few years ago there were a few articles/studies saying that that BPA were in thermal paper (ie. receipt paper). I think the conclusion was that if you were picking up a few receipts per day, the amount was negligible, but if you worke…

I believe I recall that if you used hand sanitizer and then handled a receipt the BPA transfer was significantly higher.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#374

I used to eat sardines every day trying to get the health benefits of fatty fish. They were packed in soybean oil. I drank the oil too. With time I began to have bizarre mental issues that I finally tracked down to the sardines. Sardines packed in olive oil don’t cause this issue. That’s my anecdata to share.

TBF eating something that is not part of a traditional diet every single day can have weird consequences that aren't inherent to the food itself.

There's a ton of food that we properly support and has clear benefits at reasonable amount but will trigger adverse effects on abuse.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#375

I used to eat sardines every day trying to get the health benefits of fatty fish. They were packed in soybean oil. I drank the oil too. With time I began to have bizarre mental issues that I finally tracked down to the sardines. Sardines packed in olive oil don’t cause this issue. That’s my anecdata to share.

Best to buy ones packed in water. No idea as to the quality of the oil used.

From a culinary perspective, packed in oil tend to be tastier.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#376
post #349

Do not take this work seriously unless you are a male inbred mouse of the C57BL/6N persuasion. This is a classic N=1 study of one sex and one genome of mouse. As such this work is of almost no know relevance to other strains of mice, let alone to humanity. If you want an example of how mice dietary studies should be done then look to the National Institute on Aging and its Interventions Testing Program. They use both…

It's should be taken as a serious indication that further study is needed.

Thank you. "Don't extrapolate to humans off of one mouse study." != "Don't take this seriously."

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#377
post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> use the term "broiling" for shallow/pan-frying. Unusual word here. I don't think that's right; it's more used for what you do in the oven under the "broil" setting. Americans use "saute" and "fry" in somewhat context dependent , somewhat interchangeable ways. Along with "sear" being somewhat specific to browning at high heat.

Speaking as an American... I was aware that "broiling" was a cooking method, but I have no concept of what it involves. After checking a dictionary, I still don't -- wikipedia redirects "broiling" to "grilling", and Merriam-Webster defines "broil" as "to cook by direct exposure to radiant heat: grill", with an example given of "broil the steak in the oven". I would be more likely to use "bake" for heating something i…

Grilling is _under_ a hot surface. Like broiling. But when you broil you use a different pan. Or something.

Now if you want a really weird distinction: baking and roasting. Same appliance, much more similar temperatures than you might think, often only subtly different prep.

You might think, no, you "bake" things that rise or are transformed by the process, like dough. But you might also "bake" potatoes and fish. Or you might say that roasting involves oil and basting, but you might baste baked fish. Or roasting involves an open dish or tray. But often so does baking.

In this case it really is a kind of convention in English, in the same way that adjective order force is a convention.

We generally consistently use one word for a given application or a given origin of the food.

Messes with my head.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#378

Do not take this work seriously unless you are a male inbred mouse of the C57BL/6N persuasion. This is a classic N=1 study of one sex and one genome of mouse. As such this work is of almost no know relevance to other strains of mice, let alone to humanity. If you want an example of how mice dietary studies should be done then look to the National Institute on Aging and its Interventions Testing Program. They use both…

I think this is a fair point. I see other comments pointing out the value in this as exploratory research. There's some middle ground here though. I think studies like would serve the lay reader and non-scientific community by including a disclaimer sentence in the abstract about not extrapolating conclusions from this. Their opening sentence does the opposite, "Soybean oil consumption has increased greatly in the past half-century", which seems to set up the reader to think about the impact to humans. This paper is written by scientists, for scientists, but the scientific community as a whole would be well advised to realize that lay readers and lay press will skim these articles, in particular the abstract, for the key takeaways.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#379

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suggestions on how I can get enough complete protein in such a diet? I am open to reducing meat for health if this is a factor but eat about 150 grams complete protein every day and this is hard to replace from vegetarian. The few vegetarian dishes I see with significant protein are often not nearly as good as yogurt, meat, eggs or just stuff with whey protein in it. I can't see much with comparable protein to calori…

There's 2 ways to look at protein. There's a life-span way and a health-span way. Do you want to live longer? or do you want to feel and potentially look better? When it comes to protein, these two things seem to be at odds with one another. High protein is correlated with shorter lifespans. - https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/protein... - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC-ej7HbPWg You'll notice t…

Good points and I looked into risks, I think there are some, but there also is some stuff suggesting positive brain effects, enough that it seems inconclusive.

I agree on metabolic benefits from eating 1 time or so every day but that is not a problem for me, I've done it in the past but can't build muscle on it. I am hoping something like rapamycin matures for some anti-mtor potential.

I am closer to 1.8g/kg protein since this is about the most i get any help from. Less than that I notice effects on getting stronger much slower. I agree with you on lots of vegetables with that, my diet tends to be lots of whole foods like oatmeal, yogurt, chicken, turkey, fish, chickpea, some milk and cheese with lots of different vegetable (usually the "bulk" of food I eat). Over all a mostly good diet and I have cheat meals maybe 6 times per year or less, just larger quantity of food combined with heavy exercise.

I think maybe fewer meals and fasting is good if you have prior issues, I always had excellent metabolic health, I never needed to lose weight (did need to gain it in the past, doctor orders). I do fast occasionally on a heavy cut though I have to be careful how much I do or I go too catabolic.

Last, I think "bodybuilders die young" is overstating and refers to competition bodybuilders. First almost all of them are on gear, it's just how much. And most of them who get on stage are on a lot of it and use some of the more side effect prone ones (e.g. tren, eq). Also cutting drug abuse (clen, dnp). Also heavy diuretic abuse. Mostly even the "natural" ones. I skip all this stuff, no gear, no sarms, no cutting drugs, no diuretics, I don't compete. So I think it's a lot less harm.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#380
Published Study Link: https://academic.oup.com/endo/article/161/2/bqz044/5698148?l...

Skip to methods for the good stuff.

I wonder if it would be possible to add a feature to HN whereby you could have a secondary, important link. I know on some occasions the original link is replaced with a better one.

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