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Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

universityofcalifornia.edu

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Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#271

Post by loudtieblahblah »

Pxtl wrote: post #137
simonsarris wrote: post #4

> The same UC Riverside research team found in 2015 that soybean oil induces obesity, diabetes, insulin resistance, and fatty liver in mice. Then in a 2017 study, the same group learned that if soybean oil is engineered to be low in linoleic acid, it induces less obesity and insulin resistance. > “The hypothalamus regulates body weight via your metabolism, maintains body temperature, is critical for reproduction and…

Fixating on lineolic acid is kind of hard when basically all high-heat vegetable oils contain a lot of it. If lineolic acid is the problem then basically every unsaturated cooking oil other than olive oil is now unusable. Maybe canola, depending on how much lineolic acid is safe.

canola is probably the best out of the bunch but it's still too high in omega6s.

PUFAs - as cooking oils - should be totally and utterly avoided. People should be using butter, ghee, beef tallow, coconut oil, avocado oil (which is a little higher in omega6s that i'd like but it's mostly a monosaturated fat), duck fat, emu oil.

Macademia nut oil is higher in monosaturated fats than olive oil and has a higher smoke point, but it's expensive. Tallow, butter and coconut is where it's at for high heat cookiing.

Most seed, nut, corn, and vegetable oils are trash. Cottonseed, soybean, corn, canola, grapeseed, peanut, etc..

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#272

Post by hinkley »

simonsarris wrote: post #4

> The same UC Riverside research team found in 2015 that soybean oil induces obesity, diabetes, insulin resistance, and fatty liver in mice. Then in a 2017 study, the same group learned that if soybean oil is engineered to be low in linoleic acid, it induces less obesity and insulin resistance. > “The hypothalamus regulates body weight via your metabolism, maintains body temperature, is critical for reproduction and…

We are also feeding those beans to cows, pigs, and I think chickens? People have been complaining about lineolic acid rising in these meats too.

In a way I think this gives some ammo to the vegetarian philosophy, but I'd like to know the lineolic acid content of tofu, since bean curd is not exactly equivalent to whole beans.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#273

Post by voldacar »

It's nice to see the anti seed oil discourse ramping up lately, but I'm sort of pessimistic about this. Like what is the endgame, exactly?

Seed oils are in basically everything. Trying to avoid them is like trying to avoid endocrine disruptors by not touching plastic or eating anything that has touched plastic. It's sort of an absurd thing to even attempt, it would drive you insane.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#274

Post by loudtieblahblah »

mrob wrote: post #49
sinyug wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Soybean oil I saw this video about seed oils a few months back.[1] Some of the information there tracked stuff I have been reading for a while. Decided to switch over completely to coconut oil and ghee (clarified butter). A comment on the video that matches my view on the subject: > If you want to be healthy just do the exact opposite of everything we were told about nutrition by mainstream experts for decades [1]…

>ghee Cholesterol oxides in Indian ghee: possible cause of unexplained high risk of atherosclerosis in Indian immigrant populations: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2887943/ "Substantial amounts of cholesterol oxides were found in ghee (12.3% of sterols), but not in fresh butter"

Cholesterol is more than just fat consumption. You can't talk cholesterol without talking about carbohydrates.

All fat oxidizes, some oxidize easier than others. Some are more inflammatory tahn others (omega6s are way more so than saturated fats). Carb intake has complex interactions kicking off the oxidation of fats too.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#275

Post by hinkley »

loudtieblahblah wrote: post #270
Salgat wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To note, even eggs and lard have large amounts of Linoleic acid, and I'm pretty sure lard and eggs have existed in the human diet for as long as chickens and pigs as livestock have existed.

the rates of linoleic acid in eggs, large, chicken, beef, pork have all changed drastically in the last 100 years because what we feed the animals has changed drastically. a grass fed cow has a lower omega6 profile than one in a factory farm. farmers have gotten tricky with it, raising "grass fed cows" but then for a couple months before slaughter, fattening them up with industry "feed". So now when you're at the sto…

'Grass fed' has a remarkable amount of wiggle room in it from a marketing and Truth in Advertising standpoint.

And there's also 'grass finished' which does the reverse process of grain first and grass at the end to boost the carotene a little and change the texture of the fat a bit (grain fed 'looks better' to shoppers which is part of how that changeover happened so fast)

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#276

Post by captainredbeard »

liveoneggs wrote: post #230
rvense wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um, don't we have something like 30% of our DNA in common with actual grass, nevermind grass eaters?

my grandpa weren't no fescue!

He was alfalfa

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#277

Post by hinkley »

primroot wrote: post #80
xhrpost wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Linoleic acid is what induces torpor Is this the same as ALA in flax-seed oil that is supposedly good for us?

ALA is alpha-linolenic acid (the essential omega-3 fatty acid). LA is linoleic acid (the essential omega-6 fatty acid). They are the "raw materials" of the Arachidonic Acid Cascade.

Presumably this is somewhat parallel to the poly- and mono-unsaturated fat versus saturated fat. The bones of these chemicals are pretty similar but what hangs off the molecule makes a huge difference in behavior, like CO2 versus CO.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#278

Post by zaphar »

loudtieblahblah wrote: post #251
simonsarris wrote: post #4

> The same UC Riverside research team found in 2015 that soybean oil induces obesity, diabetes, insulin resistance, and fatty liver in mice. Then in a 2017 study, the same group learned that if soybean oil is engineered to be low in linoleic acid, it induces less obesity and insulin resistance. > “The hypothalamus regulates body weight via your metabolism, maintains body temperature, is critical for reproduction and…

this is the 2nd time in a week I've seen Fire In A Bottle linked on HN. It's good to see it. This guy is so ahead of the curve.

Anecdotally when someone is believed to be "Ahead of the curve" in nutrition science they are more likelty to be shown to have shot entirely off the road in a few years.

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#279

Post by mschuster91 »

crowbahr wrote: post #69
simonsarris wrote: post #4

> The same UC Riverside research team found in 2015 that soybean oil induces obesity, diabetes, insulin resistance, and fatty liver in mice. Then in a 2017 study, the same group learned that if soybean oil is engineered to be low in linoleic acid, it induces less obesity and insulin resistance. > “The hypothalamus regulates body weight via your metabolism, maintains body temperature, is critical for reproduction and…

From the study: > One additional note on this study — the research team has not yet isolated which chemicals in the oil are responsible for the changes they found in the hypothalamus. But they have ruled out two candidates. It is not linoleic acid, since the modified oil also produced genetic disruptions; nor is it stigmasterol, a cholesterol-like chemical found naturally in soybean oil. 1. We're not mammals that exp…

> 1. We're not mammals that experience torpor. That doesn't even remotely apply to us.

We do not experience torpor naturally. That does not exclude that you can blast a human body with the right amount of hormones or substances that act like ones and artificially induce torpor in humans. NASA has been researching ways to do that for years now [1], given that even a small amount of saved resources per human on a months-long space trip saves a lot of resources in total, not to mention the potential of a reduced metabolic rate also protecting the traveling humans from cosmic radiation-induced damage.

As for "how to induce torpor", well, we don't even know what exactly causes it in animals. We are just guessing - and we are at the same time also noticing that wide swaths of the population show up with a lot of health issues that used to be either rare or mostly spread on older people. Auto-immune diseases (allergies, diabetes, neurodermitis), precocious puberty, cancers of all kinds, obesity in young people, circulatory issues, Alzheimer's and other neuro-degenerative diseases, just to point out the most obvious and most-researched. And since there are only three major things that changed over the last hundred years from the previous default - our food, the introduction of heavy industry, plastics and pollution, and our way of living under modern capitalism (your ordinary medieval farmer did not work 40 hour weeks for the entire year for his whole life) - it is not surprising that correlations appear there. The key thing is to find out if the correlation also has a corresponding causation!

[1]: https://www.nasa.gov/content/torpor-inducing-transfer-habita...

Re: Soybean oil affects hypothalamus, causes genetic changes in mice: study (2020)

#280

Post by infogulch »

goldcd wrote: post #75
version_five wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on that? It doesn't surprise we that "genetic changes" is used sensationally, just would like to know what is actually happening and whether it's uncommon or something pretty normal?

Your DNA is the "cookbook", of what your body can make. Gene expression is what your body happens to be making (and how much) from the cookbook - and's entirely normal. I'd have reserved "Genetic changes" for alterations to the cookbook.

Great analogy, thanks!
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