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Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

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Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#401

Post by emteycz »

boppo1 wrote: post #354
throwaway675309 wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess but the phrasing that he used was unbelievably condescending and you just accepted it.

It's a hard thing to describe, but among people doing that kind of job, an insult like that can be a signal that you're "on the inside" of the group. It's pretty contextual and you have to listen to their tone of voice. If you've seen Good Will Hunting, imagine Affleck and Damon's characters meeting again years down the road. Affleck might call Damon a "computer pussy" but both of them know Affleck is proud of Damon…

Exactly - and I think it's the same among programmers, and more generally in male friend groups. It's a translation btw, but I think it's a fitting one.

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#403

Post by artemonster »

kube-system wrote: post #356
artemonster wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

now you're trying to argue about a specifics of the example I've given. Its tangent to the main question: whether stereotyping on something that is a choice or inherent is different? If you say that it is, can you please elaborate?

Yes, it is different, but not in a boolean sort of way. It is impolite to make fun of people for something that is not their fault... and generally speaking, the degree to which it wasn't a choice (and the degree to which it impacts someone's life experience) contributes to the degree of impoliteness.

making fun of a group != inferring generalizing statements about a group. I am completely with you about "making fun" part, but this concrete example is different

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#404

Post by erstwhileplumb »

strken wrote: post #399
nkozyra wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's something so insidiously, backhandedly condescending about tech workers pining for the simplicity of an honest day's job that drives me nuts. Yes, there are almost always jobs with less strenuous requirements on time, fewer requirements and late nights. But the average tech worker has a pretty good gig. And if they don't they can go down the street in 2022 and get one. Trades scratch a similar itch to develop…

One of my really good friends dropped out of his chemical engineering degree in the last semester to be a landscape gardener, and seems to enjoy it much more. It's been nearly a decade so far. He hasn't gone back. The tech meme of dropping out to pick up a trade is pretty funny at times, especially when it's coming from people who couldn't change a doorknob, but I don't think jobs are one-size-fits-all, and I do thin…

I’m a constant “I’m gonna quit this shit and go farm alfalfa” comic. Not unique, but I grew up in the trades working with family.

The biggest thing that jumps out to me about programming vs my father’s work is the agency. He goes into a home, diagnoses, and fixes an issue. No MBA / PM / Scrum Bags to needlessly insert themselves into a process and cause issues. Contrasted with most jobs where I get delivered a small chunk of an issue (as a Senior / Lead) which robs me of my agency as a professional and often time just leads to more delays and defects driven by a lack of a coherent vision passed down. Rather abstract, but infuriating when I damn well know I could have delivered higher-quality and ahead of schedule. Providing “Commander’s Intent” is a very real necessity.

I don’t know that tangible vs. intangible is a factor, for me at least, making web / mobile oriented systems. Hell, even a really good shell script to codify a workflow for coworkers is insanely satisfying.

Other than that, human interaction. Having a human be genuinely satisfied that you helped them with their issue they couldn’t have solved... that’s rewarding at a level rarely ever get.

The big offer is comfort (both in workplace and in salary) is the primary offer - perhaps to many friction is the spice of life.

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#405

Post by no-s »

toyg wrote: post #335
lotsofpulp wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tools might work. But then you discover the plumber from 20 years ago did something crazy. Or the wiring makes a left turn in the space between 1st and 2nd floor for some reason. Thee dimmer switch that was $15 and should have taken 10 min to install actually does not have enough clearance behind it because a drain pipe is there, and so you need a special smaller size electrical box or you need to cut holes in th…

Just another day in the life of a legacy enterprise project maintainer.

Seriously. I bought a house to renovate and the painting turned into a drywall refactoring thanks to the chemical peel used by the previous owners…I fixed up one bathroom that actually needs a tear out just to make a deadline for move in…bath tear out was pushed out to the next major update planned…

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#407

Post by brnaftr361 »

DavidPiper wrote: post #378
brnaftr361 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read somewhere that somebody did some study with god knows what methodology (people like to use current-world HG communities, not representative of ancestry) and decided that our ancestors walked about 12mi/day. That's about 3-4h of walking daily. We have like 280k years of that selection criteria. But also we came from apes, so we're sorta shitty at this upright stuff. An aside: I also just loathe ergonomic design…

> It's unfortunate that better designs haven't caught on, aren't readily available, and tend to be inordinately expensive. Do you have any links to examples of these different designs? After using a bunch of different chairs, I'm seriously considering just repurposing my piano stool, even though I'll lose all the back support. I just can't find anything sustainably comfortable and supportive.

HAG has the Capisco, which I've eyed. There are also kneeling chairs, they tilt the pelvis forward, they can be had cheaply, but I'd hate to buy one just to throw it out. Of course there are the ball based chairs and such.

I sit seiza-style on my chair currently to enforce good posture by tilting the pelvis, but it's taxing after a while, and it took me a long time to adjust to seiza, I use a standing desk in complement.

https://store.flokk.com/us/en-gb/products/hag-capisco?model=...

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#408

Post by Fnoord »

No. I'm not handy, I have two left hands. If I were good with physical labor, I would probably fancy a trade job more. Our son (almost 1,5 y.o.) seems to like the physical stuff more than our daughter (who also lacks behind in physical development compared to curve). We joke he's going to pursue a career like plumber (there's a huge shortage for plumbers around here, so I'd wager it would earn well, too). Though there's a job shortage in general, this one stood out for longer than a few years. I just hope he finishes school, that's all. Cause without the paper, as silly as it might be at times, its gonna be more rough. Though self-employed people have to arrange their own retirement money (which is why gig economy self-employment is BS).

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#409

Post by maxgashkov »

It's funny they chose a plumber as a venue to venture to. IMO it's the closest to software engineering in terms of need to use hacky workarounds for the projects that were broken beyond repair by neglect or previous contractors (especially so in countries with less strict or non-existent building codes).

Re: Anyone else feel the constant urge to leave the field and become a plumber?

#410

Post by icedchai »

mschuster91 wrote: post #313
elorant wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, and they can also chop your hand off or otherwise seriously harm you.

Fuck up something handling PII and the GDPR fines can seriously harm you...

Not really. They’ll harm the company, if anyone notices, but not you personally.
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