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Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

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Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#301

Post by trasz »

lsaferite wrote: post #281
mavhc wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are competitors not viable? Because the USA is a large protectionist market that doesn't like EU companies doing business there? Because USA outspends EU to become dominant? Because even with the EU wide laws, it's still more expensive to follow every local law compared to USA vs USA states?

> Because the USA is a large protectionist market that doesn't like EU companies doing business there? Could you explain this one a little more?

When US can't compete, they just ban stuff. See Huawei and TikTok.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#302

Post by tagoregrtst »

DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #278
disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US is really flawed, but I wouldn't move back to the EU for double my family’s income. Which of the 27(8) countries did you live in, as they are rather different?

the problem with being an immigrant, and I have seen this on myself, is that we tend to see the host country through rose colored glasses (best case). Or if we are from a poor / unprivileged background we've been put through hell by trying to survive in the new country. And in the latter case it results in (worst case) those groups becoming the most extreme defenders of whatever that country does. That gets then comp…

Agreed, its very common. But this doesn’t apply to me. Allow me to explain:

I lived in four different countries across three continents seven different times by age 15. Throughout, middle class. Leaving Europe for Canada as a teen was extremely difficult. I still love Europe the place and Europe the people.

Finally, I moved to the US from Canada - hardly polar opposites - and was reared on a diet of anti-Americanism that took ten years to shed.

I didn't dream of coming to the US, the best grad program that I got accepted to was in the US. I didn’t want to stay, I got married. I came to love the US kicking and screaming.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#303

Post by trasz »

miohtama wrote: post #207
usrbinbash wrote: post #206

Sorry, can't hear anything, over the sound of hand-rubbing by Non-US tech companies looking forward to the ENORMEOUS competitive advantage they will be able to offer if this is actually implemented :D

The best move for the US based messaging companies (Signal, are there others?) would be to leave the United States. Apple, Google, Facebook cannot leave. Telegram has never been in the US.

What do you mean, "can't leave"? Of course they can spin off another company registered outside the US and turn the old one into a subsidiary.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#304

Post by tagoregrtst »

peoplefromibiza wrote: post #282
tagoregrtst wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get off your high horse. This is a long term international effort where irrelevant Western countries in the peripheries (that’s the EU) have nibbled away at encryption protections to make it easier for the US to do the same. It’s part of a two decades long effort by Western elites to correct their mistakes from the nineties - namely loosening the noose on information and privacy. Australia, France, UK all have dracon…

> Australia, France, UK all have draconian laws that would cause outrage (or are outright unconstitutional) in the US at least in those countries you don't have to resign for what you do in your bedroom, consensually, behind closed doors... > The only data protection the EU has is because fussy Eurocrats are annoyed that the US (and not them) get to syphon all of European’s data. [Citation needed] this comes up every…

“ at least in those countries you don't have to resign for what you do in your bedroom, consensually, behind closed doors...”

No, you go to jail instead for offending someone. But you still have a job to pay off your court debts with (the US, thankfully, doesn’t have looser pays courts).

As to the rest of your comment, I love it. Any criticism of the EU or Brussels is far right extremism and must be ignored. Its working out great for Trudeau smearing protestors and ignoring them.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#305

Post by specialist »

throwthh436 wrote: post #293
specialist wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for posting your vision. It's so easy to just criticize. Divining and then advocating for a better world is really hard. Pretty sure I agree with most of your points. Especially wrt EFF.org; after all these years, I still can't figure out what they want. It'd take me a (long) while to determine if I agree with your conclusions, because this is hard hard topic. -- I was also weened as an anarcho-libertarian.…

There's already a bill that advocates for a better world for children. But it seems like it won't be passed: https://www.wyden.senate.gov/news/press-releases/wyden-gilli... EARN IT actually undermines child safety: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20220202/17411648407/senat...

Sen Wyden has been solid. I'd totally believe the pro EARN IT rhetoric is completely divorced from reality. In my experience, this much push behind nonsensical policies is solely about pork and enriching cronies, using some manufactured outrage to moot deliberation and reasoned criticism.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#306

Post by drdaeman »

nomendos wrote: post #185
CameronNemo wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal has threatened to exit the US market in the past, IIRC.

Signal would either have to go to China or Russia (where it would dance to their tune) or shut down or quietly comply. It would be "NoSignal" from this Act on.

Russia already has a similar law since 2016, although it's applied selectively to whomever they please rather than to everyone by default. And the guise of the day is terrorism, not child abuse.

When you guys were surprised about Room 641A, Russia already had warrantless surveillance boxes mandatory for every ISP by law.

I've no clue about China, but I'd be very surprised if they're not even worse in this regard.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#307

Post by gonehome »

gonehome wrote: post #273
echelon wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> i also think it's like freedom of speech, in theory it sounds great but in reality you end up with nazis walking around if you don't have the ability to deter them. I mean this in the most gentle and sincere way: This is just fascism of a different color. When you support the curtailing of freedom of speech, then you enter into a slippery slope where it's possible that new regimes can use that power against you. In…

For what's it's worse (since we disagree elsewhere in this thread) - I'm with you 100% here. Free speech is an important principle. The way I argue it to people arguing for various forms of suppressing it is that you can't know that you'll be the one with the power to suppress speech. In a liberal (as in classical liberalism) western society it's a core value. That's why we defend the speech of others even when they…

* For what it's worth

Not sure how I managed to mangle that so badly.

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#308

Post by drdaeman »

LocalPCGuy wrote: post #288
yoyohello13 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like our opinions matter. I learned from net neutrality that my representatives will do whatever they want to do, without regard for the peoples wishes.

This same bill was shelved once before due to outcry about it. They just keep putting it back out there (very similar to Net Neutrality). The key is, to continue the pressure each time it's re-introduced (which is hard, yes). But there is some precedent that vocal outcry and campaigns to write representatives does have some impact.

The outcry came from media, not folks writing to politicians. So, write to your favorite news agency instead of/in addition to your "representative"?

Re: Key senators have voted for the anti-encryption EARN IT act

#310

Post by krainboltgreene »

FPGAhacker wrote: post #106
krainboltgreene wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've never had a left majority in either part of congress.

https://history.house.gov/Institution/Presidents-Coinciding/... “Since 1857, the government has been unified 47 times, 22 under Democratic control and 25 under Republican control” Not entertaining arguments about so and so party isn’t of this or that wing.

Haha okay well I guess if you're just going to ignore facts and substitute it with your own, have at it.

But either way, they didn't say "Democrat" they said "left".

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