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The data are clear: The boys are not all right

washingtonpost.com

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Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#821

Post by snerbles »

Gwarzo wrote: post #555
adriand wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. It’s our fault, that is, men’s. We live in a society in which we we have disproportionately had the power. And this is the result. But I don’t think it’s really a gender thing, I think it’s a power and money thing. That is, I don’t think mainly white, rich and powerful men set out to disadvantage other men. I think they were more focused on advantaging themselves to the exclusion of everyone else. What I find…

"Right. It’s our fault, that is, men’s. We live in a society in which we we have disproportionately had the power. And this is the result." This is an incredibly asinine take.

But not an uncommon one.

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#823

Post by nicbou »

pcmoney wrote: post #803
rrrrrrrrrrrryan wrote: post #785

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a uniquely American thing. I studied abroad for a semester in England, and in one of the classes I took there the (Australian) professor asked us what socioeconomic class we thought we belonged to. It was a good university, but most of the British kids answered "working class." When he asked "Why?" they answered, "Because our parents work." That always stuck with me. In England, the aristocracy is alive and well…

They also haven’t invented or built anything meaningful in several hundred years…

The Royal Society would disagree

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#824

Post by DyslexicAtheist »

unmole wrote: post #809
rayiner wrote: post #682

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think cultural legacy is more deeply intertwined with morals than people appreciate. It’s just hard to see it because you’re surrounded by it. It’s easier to notice when you compare between countries and across religious traditions. My dad was raised very religious (Muslim) in Bangladesh. His grandfather was an imam. He is non-religious and I grew up non-religious, but I joined a Christian church after I got marrie…

> Consider, for example, the obsession in Christian countries with equality. Citation needed. > They almost fall over themselves to welcome people from different ethnic backgrounds. I suspect this has something to do with Christianity’s origins as a Jewish religion adopted by the Gentiles. Yet Christian kingdoms had zero qualms about persicuting Jews for centuries. > I mean, how many societies have a religion centere…

>> Consider, for example, the obsession in Christian countries with equality.

> Citation needed.

Jacques Ellul got you covered[1], if you dig through the footnotes and references in his books you'll be able to find hundreds more.

Jacques Ellul's La subversion du Christianisme (The Subversion of Christianity)

also "Trahison de l'Occident" (The Betrayal of the West)

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Ellul#Bibliography

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#825

Post by kristjansson »

skeaker wrote: post #594
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The selection process is on Tinder, not the maternity ward, and the bar is brutally high there for men. I’ve been seeing this exact trope repeated more and more on HN lately: Some vague assertion that Tinder is the only place for matchmaking and that only a tiny number of men are getting all of the matches. It’s an objectively ridiculous claim for anyone who has experience in the real world where, yes, even “normal…

Genuinely asking, roughly how old are you? I'm in my early-mid twenties and of the ~100 people I keep in touch with my age range from high school, there has been one child born (by accident if the rumors are true) and zero marriages. Of the dozen or so people I keep in regular contact with I've gathered that this is not for lack of trying, either. Obviously there is bias here as this is all anecdotal, but I'm very cu…

I'm close to your age than some of the other commenters, but I also find that marriage/child statistic unsurprising, not least given the events of the last two years, and the assumption of a vaguely affluent, coastal peer group.

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#826

Post by nicbou »

grvdrm wrote: post #584
awaythrow483 wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 33, Ive got a fairly high IQ, make $340k in a STEM field and enough to retire tomorrow, I'm not unattractive, and put a huge amount of effort over many years into online dating. I've pretty much given up on dating. I have a total inability to find anyone I'm interested in that is interested in me. When I was younger and I wanted to go to bars and get drunk and be an idiot I had plenty of attractive sexual partner…

Something cliche but perhaps relevant: Is it instead that some of these folks who have an "easy" time actually don't care that much about the process? Not ignorance, but not spending much time over-analyzing everything. Instead, they're out and they're drawing people to them because they're not thinking about having a good time, but just doing it? It really is that simple in some ways. Focus on enjoying yourself thro…

I don't know if that approach works better in terms of numbers, but it's a lot better for your own happiness.

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#827

Post by bodge5000 »

pcmoney wrote: post #803
rrrrrrrrrrrryan wrote: post #785

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a uniquely American thing. I studied abroad for a semester in England, and in one of the classes I took there the (Australian) professor asked us what socioeconomic class we thought we belonged to. It was a good university, but most of the British kids answered "working class." When he asked "Why?" they answered, "Because our parents work." That always stuck with me. In England, the aristocracy is alive and well…

They also haven’t invented or built anything meaningful in several hundred years…

The English or rich kids?

If the former, it might be worth remembering that ARM, which many consider the be the next big leap in computing (there was a thread saying it just yesterday) is an English company. Of course I could give many more examples, the technology you're using to post this comment for one, but I think I've made my point.

If the latter, I imagine thats too generic a group to say

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#828

Post by nicbou »

LouisSayers wrote: post #447
awaythrow483 wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm 33, Ive got a fairly high IQ, make $340k in a STEM field and enough to retire tomorrow, I'm not unattractive, and put a huge amount of effort over many years into online dating. I've pretty much given up on dating. I have a total inability to find anyone I'm interested in that is interested in me. When I was younger and I wanted to go to bars and get drunk and be an idiot I had plenty of attractive sexual partner…

If online dating isn't working for you but bars did, then why not head back to the bars? (You can always drink soda water) I know it sounds a bit stupidly obvious, but do the stuff that works!

Do bars really work? I keep seeing this advice, but I never see it happening when I'm in bars. People usually show up and leave as a group, especially now with social distancing measures.

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#829

Post by bodge5000 »

throwaway46jt7 wrote: post #794
mbfg wrote: post #695

I think a big part of the despair is the obvious difference between what children are taught is the american dream vs what the american reality is. We are told america is the best place on earth with all the doors open to you to be rich. That all other forms of government are flawed and we have excellence here everywhere you look. And then you look at reality and see something else. Sure there are pockets of excellen…

> We are told america is the best place on earth with all the doors open to you to be rich. That all other forms of government are flawed and we have excellence here everywhere you look. What other countries are great compared to America? With all its flaws America is the only country where you can dream of building spaceships, create multi billion dollar tech companies in less than a decade. Any ideology that forces…

> the only country where you can dream of building spaceships, create multi billion dollar tech companies in less than a decade

And all you need is hard work, persistence, and a couple tens of millions burning a hole in your back pocket... and a legion of people, like you, who don't have that kind of capital to do the heavy lifting.

Re: The data are clear: The boys are not all right

#830

Post by dagw »

nicbou wrote: post #828
LouisSayers wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If online dating isn't working for you but bars did, then why not head back to the bars? (You can always drink soda water) I know it sounds a bit stupidly obvious, but do the stuff that works!

Do bars really work? I keep seeing this advice, but I never see it happening when I'm in bars. People usually show up and leave as a group, especially now with social distancing measures.

Do bars really work?

Depends on the bar. Certainly when I was young there where certain bars that where known as places you go to be social and meet girls and certain bars that where known as places where you sat and drank with your mates and got left alone. By selecting which bar you went to you could greatly influence how your evening went.

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