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What's new in Flash 11

adobe.com

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Re: What's new in Flash 11

#31

Post by mahmud »

ender7 wrote: post #30

Some of these are really welcome changes for me (native JSON, bezier curves, TLS sockets, DisplayObjectContainer.removeChildren). And yet... And yet I'm still planning on switching my web app to HTML5. This is coming from a guy who's sunk over two years of development into Flash. It's not because the runtime is buggy and/or crashy (it is, but it's not that bad). It's not because it's so much easier to develop in HTML…

I was a flash snob. I know AVM2 opcodes like the back of my hand. I wrote SWF and FLV processors. I fucking love Adobe.

Yeah, same here .. writing HTML and Android apps. Even our stock-take app for inventory control, I wrote it in SWT and deploy via WebStart.

I know.

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#32

Post by dgroves »

aidenn0 wrote: post #3
davidu wrote: post #2

I guess crashing isn't a feature. I'm not trying to be a troll, but let's be honest -- There has never been a version of Flash that hasn't piece a complete piece of garbage when it comes to stability and performance. If Adobe "got it" this list of "What's new" would include words like "removed" and "deprecated" and "eliminated." Those words don't appear once. They've just thrown more stuff into the kitchen sink that…

Don't forget security. It's a virtual guarantee that the new version introduces several new arbitrary code execution vulnerabilities.

Argh!!! You beet me to it.

No doubt this is going to be the most fucked up flash version ever... I can not wait to read about the sploits because the one thing you did not read about is the new 'executable stack protection' mechanisms.

I am just saying the 1980's called and they want their software back...

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#33

Post by dgroves »

melling wrote: post #15

Before everyone starts complaining about Flash, I challenge people to go 30 days without Flash. http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/141/tn_14157.html http://www.cultofmac.com/67699/uninstall-flash-for-mac-os-x-...

I have been flash free for so long I can not even recall when I last used flash...

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#34

Post by dgroves »

mikeleeorg wrote: post #27
melling wrote: post #15

Before everyone starts complaining about Flash, I challenge people to go 30 days without Flash. http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/141/tn_14157.html http://www.cultofmac.com/67699/uninstall-flash-for-mac-os-x-...

I've been using Chrome's FlashBlock extension and loving it: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/gofhjkjmkpinhpoiab... For those who want to take melling up on this challenge (and I would encourage it because it's an eye-opening experience to see much your favorite websites depend on Flash, or not), this extension is a nice bridge. Flash embeds aren't loaded automatically. Instead, a placeholder appears instead…

Indeed, people should be aware of both how widely it is used, so they can be outraged and call for a change. Namely - the death of flash.

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#35

Post by MetaMan »

georgemcbay wrote: post #26
MetaMan wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Crashing in a managed environment is never the developer's fault" !!! WHAT? Are you serious? Please educate us as to how that is done.

He's right though it depends what you mean by a "crash". An unhandled exception due to referencing a null object that caused the Flash app to crash? Developer's fault, not Adobe's. A crash that brings down the entire Flash runtime (and possibly the browser hosting it)? Adobe(or the browser vendor)'s fault, not the developers. Even if the developer does something horribly stupid in ActionScript, the runtime should nev…

Agreed. But most of the crashes I see are of the former type (I.e developers fault).

I honestly can't remember ever seeing a Flash crash actually bring down the the browser. Maybe I've been very lucky.

I see that I'm getting down voted for calling 'ED' out on his sweeping statement where he did not define what he meant by a "crash". Note that for many users a "crash" is when what ever App/game/web-page they are running stops with some error and they can't continue. My basic point is that many (most??) of these, in my experience, are down to developer error.

Many developers seem to have an irrational "hate-fest" going against Flash. For sure there's a lot wrong with it but, for me, all to often "its not the tool but the craftsman at fault".

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#36

Post by keeperofdakeys »

nextparadigms wrote: post #11
jjcm wrote: post #5

I'm very surprised to see native 64bit linux support as one of their first bullets. It may very well be too little too late though. As of late, the only thing that I've used flash for has been to supplement my tags. The native JSON / jpeg-xr / LZMA support will certainly make flash feel somewhat more lightweight, but I don't think it'll be enough to make it not feel bulky.

Shouldn't the new Web Audio API in Chrome be enough to replace that (at least for Chrome users) ?

Currently html5 audio is a bit limited, especially when you want to play multiple sounds and on time (html5 audio doesn't have latency guarantees). Of course, the web audio api is designed to fix this, firefox also has their own solution. The fact that this won't work on every browser (like iOS or android), means it isn't much of a solution for now.

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#37

Post by gerggerg »

ender7 wrote: post #30

Some of these are really welcome changes for me (native JSON, bezier curves, TLS sockets, DisplayObjectContainer.removeChildren). And yet... And yet I'm still planning on switching my web app to HTML5. This is coming from a guy who's sunk over two years of development into Flash. It's not because the runtime is buggy and/or crashy (it is, but it's not that bad). It's not because it's so much easier to develop in HTML…

air for mobile?

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#38

Post by beagle3 »

MetaMan wrote: post #25
ed wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you fault a managed system? Addresses are a few abstractions below the developer.

For me there are many real world cases which can't be handled without showing the user a fatal error. E.g. - the developer asks for an runtime created asset that doesn't exist anymore or there's a condition under which a block of code runs forever (actually in this case the flash runtime stops after 15 seconds of activity and allows the user to kill it but it's still a "crash" insofar as the user is concerned.

But Flash often crashes way worse than that; it segfaults, or raises a structured exception. It used to take browser processes with it, before Chrome made it popular to have plugins in their own process.

I suspect Flash's (lack of) stability was one of the reasons for considering this design decision in Chrome.

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#39

Post by keeperofdakeys »

mikeleeorg wrote: post #27
melling wrote: post #15

Before everyone starts complaining about Flash, I challenge people to go 30 days without Flash. http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/141/tn_14157.html http://www.cultofmac.com/67699/uninstall-flash-for-mac-os-x-...

I've been using Chrome's FlashBlock extension and loving it: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/gofhjkjmkpinhpoiab... For those who want to take melling up on this challenge (and I would encourage it because it's an eye-opening experience to see much your favorite websites depend on Flash, or not), this extension is a nice bridge. Flash embeds aren't loaded automatically. Instead, a placeholder appears instead…

Chrome has an inbuilt plugin blocker, that does the same as flash blocker. You may need to activate it in about:flags to see the option in the plugin settings. An advantage is that it doesn't depend on javascript, so it is friendly with the javascript blocker in chrome, if you are feeling very paranoid.

Re: What's new in Flash 11

#40

Post by muyuu »

ender7 wrote: post #30

Some of these are really welcome changes for me (native JSON, bezier curves, TLS sockets, DisplayObjectContainer.removeChildren). And yet... And yet I'm still planning on switching my web app to HTML5. This is coming from a guy who's sunk over two years of development into Flash. It's not because the runtime is buggy and/or crashy (it is, but it's not that bad). It's not because it's so much easier to develop in HTML…

Is it really easier to develop in HTML5?? I haven't looked into it lately, but it was a nightmare last time I checked. Compatibility problems, massively different performance across browsers (so you have to go lowest common denominator), every guy and his dog coming with his own layer of abstraction and libraries to make for deficiencies that simply don't exist in AS3...

I'd be interested in looking into it again if you can truly achieve the level of compatibility, penetration and dependability (performance-wise) that you can achieve with flash. Any pointers will be appreciated.

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