If you’re like me and somehow missed out that there’s an significant mesh of neurons in your guts that’s capable of independent neurotransmitter release, you should look up the enteric nervous system. Intuitively, at least, it seems to make sense of all the ‘gut’ connections to mood.
Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
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Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#52Gut microbiome researcher here - not involved in this study but happy to answer questions or dig in with anyone interested!
At the current pace of research and studies, when do you think we could expect to see something come to 'market' that could be used - first as a diagnosis and then as a treatment/medication/technique. As someone with IBS - right now I feel like there is no clear 'problem' defined for it. You are just categorized by the doctor (Rome 3 or whatever) and people go through various tests, medications, non-fda approved stuf…
At a broad scale, I would say it will be 1-2 years before fecal transplants receive approval as a therapy for recurrent C. diff infection, at least 5 years before a bug-as-drug will be available, and at least 7 years before a microbe-derived natural product is on the market as a pharmaceutical. It takes an incredible amount of work to get from these associational studies to a pharma-grade product.
In the interim, I think there will continue to be a bunch of diagnostics and probiotics companies that (IMO) are bordering on absolute nonsense. There is very little predictive value to the tests supplied by most of these companies, and the data on probiotic efficacy is bad in humans. There is good evidence of probiotic and prebiotic effectiveness in animal husbandry (e.g. fish and livestock) but the data just aren't there in humans.
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#53Tangential: Is there any evidence that pro biotic foods or supplements can increase gut health? Given the evident importance of gut health, I wonder whether it's worth using something like this, to grab a random example: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Restored-Bio-Cultures/dp/B082SZXBF2...
Lots of accessible information can be found at https://nutritionfacts.org.
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#54Great to see the gut brain axis becoming more well known in medicine. Less than 10 years ago it was considered near pseudoscience to consider that the gut could actually influence the brain. https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/wellness-and-preventi... https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4367209/#:~:tex... . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gut%E2%80%93brain_axis
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#55Gut microbiome researcher here - not involved in this study but happy to answer questions or dig in with anyone interested!
At the current pace of research and studies, when do you think we could expect to see something come to 'market' that could be used - first as a diagnosis and then as a treatment/medication/technique. As someone with IBS - right now I feel like there is no clear 'problem' defined for it. You are just categorized by the doctor (Rome 3 or whatever) and people go through various tests, medications, non-fda approved stuf…
Had a great doctor that helped me get started, after many that did a shoddy job, and this has been my experience as well.
Very much a 'seems like IBS, try low FODMAP, see what works and doesn't via experience,' which was pretty amazing/alarming how little is understood about our guts.
I'd love to know when the science is going to start catching up. Especially since I think it'll be interesting to find out if something has been added to our diets that's causing an increase in intolerance over the last decade+.
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
I wonder which gut bacteria make me crave cheap Mac and Cheese...
It seems like you are joking, but many of the fecal transplant patients report their food preferences changing, sometimes dramatically.
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
My personal, completely unsubstantiated take is: your diet allows certain bacteria to thrive (or not). It’s less about trying to avoid the bad ones and more about trying to nurture the good ones. One incredible thing you can do for your gut is eat more fiber; which the vast majority of Americans don’t. Try psyllium husk powder (the stuff in Metamucil). Eat less refined sugar and saturated fat; eat more raw and fermen…
That is as may be, however, this study shows that removing that bacteria helps with mood disorder. And, there is no evidence that diet gives you this bacteria. Nor that it can help remove this one, either. That is, discussion of diet is a bit of a non sequitur. Not wrong, but also not necessarily relevant.
The study also does not show that removing Morganella resolved depression; the study did not attempt to remove it, and a researcher is quoted as saying it’s not clear how one would do so (last line of the article):
> But it’s less clear how Morganella could be eliminated from the gut to relieve symptoms. “That’s a bit more challenging.”
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#58Tangential: Is there any evidence that pro biotic foods or supplements can increase gut health? Given the evident importance of gut health, I wonder whether it's worth using something like this, to grab a random example: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Restored-Bio-Cultures/dp/B082SZXBF2...
There's so much variety between people, one formulation for one person might work well for one person but have negative effects on another even if they have a supportive diet and lifestyle. People might simply have to trial multiple formulas that have the right mix of strains before they find one that works for them.
Prebiotic foods seem to have more consistent results on gut health, according to some studies.
(not medical/health advice disclaimer)
Re: Gut microbe linked to depression in large health study
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
Or Kimchi if you're into Korean food.
Do you have an easy to make recipe?
Rinsed pickle jars work great, a head of Napa cabbage usually fills about 2+1/2 ~ 3 jars. If you're not into high spicy, dial back the red pepper by about half, for your first try. If you don't like funky, skip the fish sauce or any seafood component, I always do this so that the flavor won't clash with some dishes, you can always add fish sauce to a dish but you can't remove it.
I ferment it for about 3 days at about 65 ~ 68 degrees(f), then into the fridge. It keeps indefinitely but is best within a few months.
Do not bring it into work, just as you would not microwave fish at work. The aroma is very much not to everyone's preference, even when made without seafood.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaoA7SKN0g0 https://www.maangchi.com/recipe/easy-kimchi