This must be desperation due to losses of paying subscribers due to the diversity of Microsoft ways to do this, as well as many others that make pdf's.
Time for Adobe to fade into another company. Are they also losing share in their other photo products = a broad decline?
Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
261–270 of 592 posts
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#262I manage adobe subs for my company. When you log into the adobe user management portal you can see all of your users and the products we pay for but you can’t pull up a “last used date”. This way I would know who to cancel if not used in a long time.
I have complied to adobe about this for years and they say it would violent the privacy of the users we are paying for - yet I have their email addresses.
I try all the time to get users to try others products when they ask for an adobe product subscription.
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#263For anyone stuck in this dark pattern here is a trick I've used in the past: Adobe won't let you cancel without paying the remainder of your subscription fee however you can switch to a different plan. As soon as you switch you'll have the ability to cancel your "new" plan within 14 days. If you cancel after 14 days they'll charge you the early termination fee.
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Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#264Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are stories when Adobe charged for several missing years as soon as credit card were linked.
CC chargeback time
Chargebacks aren't the magic spell people think they are.
The credit card company may elect to side with the merchant, or the merchant may decline to do business with you again in the future (not ideal if your income relies on access to these tools in the future), or the merchant may take legal action against you, or the credit card company may decide to close your card account.
You can't just do whatever you want and then claim 'chargeback!'
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#265I am not quite sure why people don't grasp that it's an annual plan for really expensive software. "Annual plan, billed monthly" is about as easy as it's going to be in four words on a button or by a button. If you could rent it for just a month now and then, wouldn't you only rent it in the months you need it? They make it so you can't. There's a solution: DON'T USE IT. Ask yourself seriously: what is it you want to…
> There are all sorts of viable competitor apps
> monopoly
You lost me there. Are you using a different definition of monopoly than the usual one?
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#266Surely with the right data, we can quantify the exact effect of a dark pattern. Once quantified. We can we bring a class action suit against this kind of practice!? Once established as a precedent, the existence of this kind of lawsuit would universally improve web experience
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#267Earlier quoted context omitted.
> GIMP is pretty darn good GIMP could be pretty darn good if they gave 20 UX designers another 10 years to redo their entire UX. As is, it's a usability nightmare. Whenever I'm forced to use it, it feels like I spend 70% of my time fighting with the horrible UI, 25% of the time Googling how to do trivial things because it's very much not obvious, and 5% doing what I actually want.
That's exactly what made Krita so good. Every once in a while they'd shut a bunch of the developers in a room with a bunch of artists/users, have the users complain about everything that pisses them off, and get all those things fixed. The resulting application is obviously driven by what artists enjoy, and it feels that way. Strongly recommended.
The stupid pandemic has made that impossible for us for quite some time, but our current workflow of having artists discuss stuff on krita-artists.org with developers listening, then making a plan and then working on works quite well for us.
But I miss the sessions where each artist present would have two hours to demo making something with the express message: tell us what you hate, and we're not allowed to tell you "oh, but you could do this using that."
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#268https://www.adobe.com/downloads.html Click the Start Free Trial and experience the flow for yourself. You're presented with 3 options, but it defaults to the 2nd option. Instead of using more straightforward "Annual Subscription - Billed monthly", it uses rather unusual "Yearly - Billed Monthly" phrasing. The default selection makes it less likely that you're going to read the fine print. You also don't get the Total…
I think the language is pretty clear. The fact that there is a much more expensive monthly option makes it even more obvious that the "yearly" option is a year long commitment. Not sure why you'd need to read the fine print. It also says "Fee applies if you cancel after Feb 26" -- as long as that implies that you can cancel without paying a fee until then, I think that's pretty clear? Though seeing how many people fe…
I think it's partly because you're looking at this through HN posting and you are aware of the dark pattern issue. Even if it poses no problem for 95% if people, if it does for 5%, it's a big number.
the problem is, they're deviating from the norm by doing things:
> Offering annual pricing, but with monthly pay option. > Imposing rather stiff penalty.
Stuff like this... is not that common in ordinary e-commerce. You either pay 1 full year price and enjoy substantial savings or go monthly.
They could've made this info much more clear so that the comprehension wouldn't be a problem for 99% of the people. But they didn't.
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#269Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're just defending the right of a giant corporation to communicate poorly in a way that enriches them at the expense of customers, who are often struggling artists. > "Annual plan, billed monthly" is about as easy as it's going to be in four words on a button or by a button. It's absolutely insane that you think Adobe has fulfilled their obligations to communicate to the customer what they're getting into by putti…
For most users it isn't a bad deal at all. It's a 33% price savings over straight monthly, and I suspect many/most users have subscriptions much longer than a year. This all seems a bit overwrought. Like the root post, I cannot fathom who would go through a purchase process that included the phrase "Annual plan, billed monthly" and not clue in. Or that that drop down includes a separate straight monthly plan at a sig…
> This all seems a bit overwrought. Like the root post, I cannot fathom who would go through a purchase process that included the phrase "Annual plan, billed monthly" and not clue in.
FWIW (mine is the root post and) I am definitely coming around to the idea that it should at least say "Yearly", and maybe say "in monthly installments", because that language may be more familiar to buyers. But the rest of your point about the other plan you can choose is right.
I don't yet believe Adobe is evil, either. Banal, corporate, plodding, slow-witted, yeah. It is definitely an 800 pound gorilla.
Re: Adobe tricks users into a 12 month contract
#270For anyone stuck in this dark pattern here is a trick I've used in the past: Adobe won't let you cancel without paying the remainder of your subscription fee however you can switch to a different plan. As soon as you switch you'll have the ability to cancel your "new" plan within 14 days. If you cancel after 14 days they'll charge you the early termination fee.
Or you can just block the recurring payments and wait for them to come at you? Anyway a "free" trial that asks for your cc number is obviously not free. Better to stay away of those to be on the safe side.
Not a good idea if you, in the future, may actually need Adobe's services again.