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My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

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Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#391

Post by me_me_mu_mu »

Is it weird that the more tech becomes like this the more I feel checked out?

I don’t want smart devices, nor do I want to be online 24/7. However it’s hard to escape this reality. My thermostat (in apartment) recently reset due to a power issue and I had to have maintenance over to do its configuration again. They had to come twice because after setting it up they have to figure out how to connect it to Wi-Fi for a software update.

Before this apartment I lived in one where all the appliances were straight out of 1950/60. They were retro af but they worked without any issues for the time I lived there. Here I’ve had issues every month.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#392

Post by freewilly1040 »

hungryforcodes wrote: post #170
buro9 wrote: post #5

Looks like a Miele. That menu can be exited (the image where it says "Software Update", the tiny bit on the right... that's a scroll bar of multiple options including the ability to exit this menu), but it does imply that the dishwasher is already connected to Wi-Fi and that it has determined that there is an update available. There are few times that a dishwasher is interacted with, if not when you go into the menu…

"the Wi-Fi is useful... the dishwasher auto-doses the powder, rinse aid, salt, etc... and can let me know the levels of those." I do appreciate your respect for the usefulness of this functionality -- I just throw my laundry in the machine, press ON and then press START, throw in a random amount of soap and 60 minutes later or so I have clean clothes.

Wi-Fi wouldn’t seem to help though… the machine would need to have the relevant sensors locally.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#393

Post by brnt »

fullstop wrote: post #194
dtech wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be interested in seeing a comparison on this. Washing dishes is a pretty mechanically limited process. I can't imagine that much improvement has been made.

There have been improvements in the amount of water used since mine was made.

Water consumption I can imagine, but power consumption? And by how much anyway?

Improvements in these appliances always feel a little like those percentages on dishwashing liquid. If I would multiple all the improvements since 1990 I think one drop of detergent will be enough for the rest of my life.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#395

Post by entropicdrifter »

jacquesm wrote: post #372
jancsika wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To be fair, it could also get functionality updates This is an important point that owners[1] sometimes miss. For example, if the owner makes a deal to partner with the maker of a particular detergent tab, the owner could create a new feature that only works with those tabs and not regular powder detergent. 1: Owner: the person who owns the firmware being sent over WiFi.

Or, maybe the detergents don't matter all that much and should be generic enough that you can use them in any dishwasher.

Pretty sure the person you were responding to was pointing out more ways that wifi is an anti-feature for a dishwasher

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#396

Post by LegitShady »

scrollaway wrote: post #61
stragies wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, that tweet is click-bait meant to generate outrage clicks and follows. Most of the submissions on the front-page have -at best- incomplete titles.

I'd have given the poster the benefit of the doubt but then they come out with hate-inciting nonsense trash like this: https://twitter.com/isislovecruft/status/1487947782585417728 I don't even know what to make of that anymore. Just because it's self-deprecating doesn't make it okay.

>hate-inciting

I don't see it.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#397

Post by cproctor »

dylan604 wrote: post #308
cproctor wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think in the end it's not abut utility--adding "smart" lets you dramatically bump the price. Look at smoke detectors (as an example I was thinking about this morning): the best-rated (Consumer Reports) wired smoke detector costs $31. Ten-year sealed battery models cost less. But the smart smoke detectors start at $130. These cost another $2 in hardware and some dev (and probably certification) costs to recoup, but…

I'm not sure. Look at "smart" TVs. Their prices continue to go down. Why? They are heavily subsidized by all of the analytics they earn from the data you provide them. By lowering the price, it makes it easier to sell to more and more people. Raising the prices does not. Not sure of the number of units sold comparing dishwashers vs TVs, so maybe there's not enough volume in dishwasher? Also, I can only imagine the an…

That's a good counter-example, and I agree with your suggestion that the value of the analytics probably explains the difference. (The value of smoke detector analytics is probably even lower than that of dishwashers!) So maybe we could agree that adding "smart" results in a more profitable product, whether that's because of a higher sale price, higher ongoing revenues, or both.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#398

Post by amelius »

jancsika wrote: post #267
pmontra wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, it could also get functionality updates. For example they could upload a new totally different UX loved by the designers and that nobody else understands how to use ;-)

> To be fair, it could also get functionality updates This is an important point that owners[1] sometimes miss. For example, if the owner makes a deal to partner with the maker of a particular detergent tab, the owner could create a new feature that only works with those tabs and not regular powder detergent. 1: Owner: the person who owns the firmware being sent over WiFi.

This is why you should never allow a printer to directly connect to the internet.

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#399

Post by EricE »

xnyan wrote: post #307
fortran77 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a Miele speed oven that arrived with a major defect: Microwave worked, but heat modes didn't. They sent a repair crew and there was a missing wire harness in the circuitry. It never could have worked. My experience with "high end" appliances in general (Bosch, Miele, Wolf, Subzero) is that it's a tax on "rich people". They're not better than top-line LG, etc.

I have to sort-of disagree with you! I've used 100s of dishwashers (used to work at a test lab) and Miele dishwashers are indisputably "better" (more on that below) than anything else on the consumer market, and I would be completely willing to bet you a nice dinner that you would agree after using one. Same for their vacuums, they are on a completely different level of performance than anything else I've used. All t…

Best thing for carpets is a central vacuum system. Oversize the motor unit and you can get units that will suck up 2" rocks with zero problems. The noisy motor can be located anywhere instead of in the room with you - I love to put it outside in the garage. And as someone with allergies, the biggest advantage of a central vac is it can be plumbed to fart the exhaust outdoors!

And if you have hard surface floors there is nothing faster than pulling out a lightweight flexible hose with a floor brush and running the vac over it. Faster than sweeping and again doesn't stir up dust/dander/hair like sweeping does.

I will never own a house without a central vac. And if you are really OCD about your carpet cleaning there are Wet/Dry central vac systems that have built in carpet cleaners. Will automatically discharge the waste water to the sewer. A bit pricy and exotic but I have a few friends who if they owned such a system would probably use them weekly (and mold the heck out of their carpets too!).

Re: My dishwasher won’t start until I let it update its firmware over the WiFi

#400

Post by LegitShady »

cjrp wrote: post #29
LegitShady wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>because cycle times are usually just estimates Why is that? what diagnostics are it running to tell if it needs to run longer? I thought they ran by timers, in which case cycle times are...cycle times.

Modern-ish ones usually have a dirty-water-sensor; I believe it works by shining light through the water on the way out of the machine to see (roughly) how dirty it is. Clean water = cycle over, dirty water = keep going!

So if the water never gets dirty it doesn't turn off? How does it judge how dirty the dishes are to tell how dirty the water should be?

Seems fancy but nonsense.

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