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Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

fullstackeconomics.com

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Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#291

Post by lagadu »

SilasX wrote: post #98
School-Cotton wrote: post #68

Quip from a friend from a (relatively) poor country: “Before I moved to the US, it would have seemed bizarre to me that someone could be rich enough to afford a car but not be able to afford a driver”.

Reminds me of another discussion where some of us were confused about someone retrofitting child seats in a Ferrari: how would you be rich enough to afford a Ferrari as a toy/show-off car, but not also have a normal, functional car for when you need to drive the child around (or a chauffer)? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24762683

I was in that situation. My only car was a two-seat convertible lovely car but at some point when I got good at surfing I needed a way to transport my board from my house to the beach (about 5km). I decided to sell my car and buy a larger luxury one that could carry my board and still be enjoyable to be in. Obviously I could afford to get a second, cheap, car to do that but the hassle of having two cars just wasn't worth the trouble for me.

It's the same for your example I suspect: if you can do it in a single car, that's often the option with the least amount of hassle.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#292

Post by 323 »

fxtentacle wrote: post #274
Aeolun wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He doesn’t seem particularly mind bogglingly rich to me? Maybe his behavior?

I thought he got $80 mio in Uber shares some years ago. In Ho Chi Minh City - the capital of his home country - you can buy a good freshly cooked lunch like Com Suon Op La (steak with egg, rice and fresh vegetables) for $0.50 So for everyday living, $80mio in Vietnam is going to feel like $8bio in the US (because steak in a restaurant is $50 instead of $0.5 for a 100x multiplier in living costs).

Parent was saying that if you saw this guy on the street, you wouldn't think he's a deca-millionaire just by the looks, which is what you implied. In most pictures he projects a middle manager look.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#293

Post by midasuni »

Arnavion wrote: post #190
dustintrex wrote: post #111

Interestingly enough, I'm typing this in Singapore, where in 2022 it's quite common to have a "maid" (helper/domestic worker, in the current local lingo), but no car. Singapore imports domestic workers for poor neighbouring countries like the Philippines and Myanmar, which keeps wages very low, on the order of US$450/month, not too far off Christie's inflation-adjusted US$220/month. Even the fully loaded cost with go…

Sure, the cost of a car is one factor, but the bigger factor is that Singapore is small and well-connected with public transport. It's quite normal for someone to live in one end of the city and take bus / train to the other end for work.

I spent a month in singapore a few years back, about 5 miles from the office. I took uber everywhere though - bill was about £450 for the month when I put the expenses in.

Uber was about 15-20 minutes, public transport took over an hour. That’s 40 hours a month extra time, and my time is worth far more than £11 an hour when my company’s paying £3k for the apartment alone.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#294

Post by fragmede »

glitchc wrote: post #131
thaumasiotes wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I understood your parent comment: - The vendor charges every customer according to the customer's social class. A white guy pays through the nose. A servant-class local pays a modest amount. It doesn't matter who the food is supposed to be for. - Thus, it is cheaper for the white guy to hire a housekeeper than to buy and prepare his own food. The white guy's food, if he has a housekeeper, will only cost as mu…

The poster got the OP’s point but you didn’t get his. Presumably the expat is giving the housekeeper a grocery allowance, she’s not spending her own money. The merchant could certainly make a deal with the housekeeper to charge expat prices and the two could split the difference.

That only works if the foreigner has no friends and doesn't talk to anybody about how much they pay their housekeeper and the grocery budget. And if the foreigner just pays t housekeeper a lump sum, rather than a wage + cost of supplies, then that also won't work.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#295

Post by SergeAx »

mFixman wrote: post #282
SergeAx wrote: post #264

"Back in the 1960s, the economist William Baumol observed that it took exactly as much labor to play a string quartet in 1965 as it did in 1865—in economics jargon, violinists hadn’t gotten any more productive. Yet the wages of a professional violinist in 1965 were a lot higher than in 1865." This is actually brilliant and deep. We may argue a lot that music education became more expensive, violins themselves cost mo…

> housing prices are driven by the average income They are driven by the average income of the wealthiest $number_of_homes renters. If there are not enough homes in a single city then a lot of people will pay very significant part of their salary to have a place to live.

This is a very valid addition that I've skipped for clarity. But rental prices are very location-bound, and we can build only that much houses in a given location.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#296

Post by mgoetzke »

pcardoso wrote: post #233
elcritch wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny, I found shop vendors from some Arabic cultures would almost become offended if you _didn't_ barter with them -- at least if they knew you weren't just a tourist. For the (American) tourists wandering through they'd suck it up and just charge them 10x the price. ;)

Also funny, I visited Jordan 2 years ago, right before the pandemic. I was expecting to have to haggle prices like in other places but it just didn't happen, didn't feel I was paying tourist prices at all. Street sellers didn't push us to buy stuff. A street restaurant in Amman that didn't have a menu charged us around €4 for the meal, which was dirt cheap for what we had. All in all it was a very nice experience.

Seconded. Jordan is a pretty great place as far as I experienced it too. Though I was not alone myself, but watching interactions with others it was all very decent.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#297

Post by [deleted] »

fxtentacle wrote: post #205
mcorning wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised to hear that it is impolite to not have a housekeeper if you are an expat. To which places are you referring?

50 years ago, Germany also still had a popular saying "Eigentum verpflichtet" which I would translate as "ownership creates a duty". In short, people who owned companies, large plots of land, or other infrastructure were expected to spread their wealth by creating jobs. Nowadays, the spirit still lives on somewhat in the fact that we have free public scenic hiking trails through what looks like very expensive private…

[deleted]

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#298

Post by throwaway0a5e »

andi999 wrote: post #122
freddie_mercury wrote: post #16

Agatha Christie's quote is well-known but the exact same situation still holds today in many countries. Here in Viet Nam it is extremely common for middle income families to have a maid or nanny (or both) but not a car. The cars themselves are quite expensive. A Honda Civic is $33,000 by itself whereas a nanny (6-days a week, 10 hours a day) is $400-500/month and a maid who works 9 hours a week, i.e. 3 days a week, 3…

Also the extra usefulness of a car is much lower. In SEA you can transport the whole family on a scooter.

You can transport your family on a motorcycle or scooter in the US too. You'll just be on a first name basis with all the cops everywhere you go regularly because even if the cops themselves dgaf there will be no shortage of people calling them on you.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#299

Post by kragen »

yreg wrote: post #197
freddie_mercury wrote: post #16

Agatha Christie's quote is well-known but the exact same situation still holds today in many countries. Here in Viet Nam it is extremely common for middle income families to have a maid or nanny (or both) but not a car. The cars themselves are quite expensive. A Honda Civic is $33,000 by itself whereas a nanny (6-days a week, 10 hours a day) is $400-500/month and a maid who works 9 hours a week, i.e. 3 days a week, 3…

I don't think it's reasonable to quote the price of a new car (which is in tens of thousands) when determining whether someone can afford a car. I sold my last car for €500 and it wasn't in the worst shape.

Where mechanics' labor is cheap, used cars cost nearly as much as new cars. This surprised me too when I first observed it.

Re: Agatha Christie could afford a maid and a nanny but not a car

#300

Post by [deleted] »

igorkraw wrote: post #221
fxtentacle wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

50 years ago, Germany also still had a popular saying "Eigentum verpflichtet" which I would translate as "ownership creates a duty". In short, people who owned companies, large plots of land, or other infrastructure were expected to spread their wealth by creating jobs. Nowadays, the spirit still lives on somewhat in the fact that we have free public scenic hiking trails through what looks like very expensive private…

"private property is subordinate to the common good" is even in our "Constitution" (grundgesetz, literally foundational law), although it has been neutered by precedent and other laws. The right of way is a concept which is still strong in a bunch of countries, including England and famously Norway where "Allemansretten" allows "all men" the right to camp in public spaces. I personally find these habitual rights an i…

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