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Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

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171–180 of 474 posts

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#171

I did the opposite and found the us much better. Pay and opportunities are infinitely better, people are friendlier, having a car is much easier and more convenient.

The first points are salient. The last point is interesting, since a car is generally much more required in the US, yes it is easier and more convenient to have a car in the US, as well as a buttload cheaper, but life without a car is (generally) a lot less easy or convenient.

I think it depends on where you live. If you live in New York, LA, Chicago, Seattle a lot of the big cities have such horrible traffic I can see the want to get rid of your car.

If you live in a place like Austin Texas and work from home, like I do. Having a car is a delight. I can go in any direction and bring my stuff I can get stuff from the store and bring it home. I've lived without a car in New York City, there's a lot of downsides to that. You don't have the freedom to just go to IKEA and get a something.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#172
post #15

I'm just outside London, moved here to marry my English wife from Vegas. I work part time doing basic IT for a US law firm due to health issues after heart surgery, and Yankee dollars are worth jack shit here - I'm not making serious tech industry money, but over here it's barely enough to survive on. Housing is always smaller than you'd get in (at least the western) US for the same price, and I'd bet that's true pre…

> Despite its reputation, I find that Europe is far more provincial than the US when it comes to food - a lot of stuff you think of as ubiquitous in the West will be "foreign" food and harder 48 to find. (And if you like tacos, stay on that side of the pond.)

That’s because you are just outside London, and the UK bar London Zone 1 and 2 is the third world of gastronomy.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#173
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's like a fucking Joy Division video here from October through April. :-D So people used to the Pacific Northwest would fit right in.

Yeah, unclear how this is relevant to the US->Europe topic. Moving from LA to Minneapolis will be depressing, moving from Rome to London will too.

Oh for real I'd take London weather any day rather than MSP weather.

No context. Minneapolis is "hot like hell" in summer and "cold like hell" in winter.

London is mild and rainy but it's not too bad.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#174

I've done it, and it was one of the best decisions of my life. WHERE: I'm Australian, moved to LA when I was 18 and lived there for 15 years. Then, I moved from Los Angeles to Germany (Duesseldorf), and then to Vienna, Austria. WHAT SACRIFICE: No more In 'n Out Burger, no more decent Mexican/TexMex food, no more LA food trucks. These are literally the only things I miss about the USA. Literally every other aspect of…

> "I've completely lost the brain-dead nationalist mentality that had infected me in my earlier life, I've gained Immense amounts of respect for humanity, ..."

>"The weather was pretty good in LA. But, still: Americans."

The latter statement clearly negates the former. It's fascinating that the irony of those two conflicting statements was completely lost on you.

Further your use of a monolithic "Americans" is almost comical. Honestly it sounds as though maybe you didn't get out of LA very much in your 15 years. And as others have also pointed out LA is not at all representative of the rest of the country.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Wow, high roller. Talk about vain. I wasn't talking about money.

Well, think of it like this: I worked hard, contributed hard, and chased the American dream. I found it distasteful and repugnant - so I moved.

(And, btw, $2,000,000 is hardly "high-roller" status, spread out in taxes over 15 years... unless of course you're one of those "living under a bridge because medical bankrupcy" Americans, lol..)

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#176
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vienna is one of the nicest and wealthiest cities in Europe. LA is a car-centric sprawling cesspool. Even for the US, it’s uniquely terrible. If you’d moved to some of the less desirable locations in Europe, you’d probably find them to be a shithole, too. Your lack of perspective (“how much of a shithole the USA really is”) is something I’d only expect from someone half your age on their first backpacking tour of Eur…

Geez someone hit a nerve, eh? I'm a Canadian and I've travelled most of Europe, and most of the US (among other parts of the world). The simple fact that the US doesn't have universal healthcare, and refuses to do anything real about it, or other endemic self-inflicted issues like gun violence - problems the rest of the modern world solved long ago! - kinda puts you at the bottom of the list of modern/developed count…

I lived in Canada with an ex-girlfriend for two years and her whole family would pay out of pocket for dental care in the US because the alternative was waiting months (or in the worst case, 2 years) for an appointment. Even for things that should be a dental emergency.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#177
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Australia is a different dimension altogether - you have a lot of the trappings of Western (US/European) culture, but none of the advantages of access to a free market. Personally, I can't stand Australian culture, nor American either these days - which isn't to say I'm launching into an adopted German/Austrian stance, just that .. being away from these lands for a decade at least in each case, I started to see the s…

I'm not sure if this is intentional but in all your comments you just come across as a hateful, angry person.

I definitely am glad I left the USA, and I for sure hate what Americans are doing to the world. I think its time a lot of you left, frankly.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> LA is a car-centric sprawling cesspool. Even for the US, it’s uniquely terrible. LA isn’t even the worst in that regard (I’d take LA over DFW) I don’t know where you are from, but LA is actually representative of large swaths of the US, and highlights some of the best things about America (namely multiculturalism and diversity)

>LA is actually representative of large swaths of the US No, not even close.

Yes, yes it is.

Not identical, but representative yes.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20 years - I left just after 9/11, during which period I witnessed the USA collectively shitting itself, and during which I decided to play no part in the USA's continued economic survival. Far better to have moved to Germany and get things happening in a country not inclined to blood-lust because it was finally attacked the way it had been attacking countries, with impunity, for decades prior. The German culture's p…

> The German culture's proclivity for peace-making I had hitherto been unaware of this proclivity, thanks for educating us all.

It’s actually become somewhat of an issue nowadays. Germany has such low acceptance of any military action that even in a situation like right now, where Ukraine is at risk of being invaded, the vast majority is against any action.

Germany is still doing cleanup of WW2 damages today, everyone has experienced at least one evacuation due to old leftover bombs being found. It’s hard to support war when its damages are still deep in the collective consciousness

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#180
I'm an American who has now lived in Iceland just over seven years.

Sacrifices:

Iceland is one of the most expensive countries in Europe (last I checked, about on par with Monaco) and software engineer salaries in my experience generally -don't- reflect that.

Iceland is also (surprise!) an island, so getting anything shipped here is both slow and expensive. Ideally, learn to live without stuff you could normally get Amazon same-day shipping for in the states. Never mind the Icelandic postal service is a subject of constant derision for how bad it is at everything.

The weather is terrible (though mostly wind and rain - the temperature is kept mild by the Gulf Stream) for most of the year, with maybe a couple months of summer if a year is particularly lucky.

Employment options for a non-Icelandic-speaker are limited outside "immigrant jobs". This is a consideration both for your prospects as well as, if you're with someone, -their- job prospects. I do think this is slowly changing (slowly getting more high-tech companies that want to attract foreign talent), but at the same time UTL (the immigration directorate) has become tougher about foreign hires in the past few years.

Social life very much depends on your circumstance. It is very easy for a foreigner to fall into a pit of being totally alone because although everyone here speaks perfect English, virtually all social life is still conducted in Icelandic. And there aren't a ton of resources to learn Icelandic from (as opposed to, say, French, Spanish, or Italian). This can be mitigated to an extent both with work connections and local foreigner gatherings.

Dating is also dependent on circumstances. I'm a conservative-ish Christian looking for same and they (almost) don't exist in Iceland. But I have known more secular foreigners who have both met natives and other foreigners here, so it can work depending what you're looking for.

Icelanders are -very- laid back. This can be a pro or con depending on your temperament, but it took a little while for me to get used to. This applies both to time (expect that Icelanders are either late or decide last-minute not to show) as well as to expectations. The unofficial Icelandic motto is "Þetta reddast" which roughly translates to "Everything will work itself out". That sounds cool until you hear it coming from your plumber/electrician/doctor/contractor.

To that last point, I don't recommend Icelandic healthcare. Yes, it's covered by taxes so upfront costs are low, but Icelandic doctors in my experience (and that of other foreigners I've worked with, including European) are quite resistant to actually doing anything. I know a guy who had a serious condition that the Icelandic doctors refused to operate on despite every other doctor he got an opinion from outside Iceland recommending an operation. He was eventually able to push those recommendations through and get what he needed, but it was a lot harder than it should have been.

Living this far north, the seasons have a notable impact on mood and maybe even mental health for some. I've mitigated this somewhat with a sunlamp, but it's still a thing. "Fortunately" it affects everyone so empathy for it is easy to find.

Benefits:

I love that, as is my impression of the other Nordic countries, work is just work and people generally live to have lives. Icelanders are a very creative/artistic people. I know a bunch of musicians here as well as a couple authors.

Iceland is an extremely peaceful country. Both in the sense there's virtually no street crime (political corruption is another question, but at least that stays mostly out of sight) and in that there's no standing military (the closest thing is a coast guard). Also people tend to trust their government (there was none of the American gnashing of teeth over either masks or vaccines).

The landscape is world-famously beautiful. It's sort of surreal living in a global tourist destination.

Although I can't vote yet, I appreciate the parliamentary system over the US's two-party system, although this is far from unique to Iceland among European countries.

Citizenship requirements are pretty simple. Just stay here long enough and learn the basics of the language. Alternatively, marry a citizen. If you can somehow swing residence in Iceland, it can be a good gateway to European citizenship, which can open lots of other doors.

Not unique to Iceland either, but I do believe there's value to living as an immigrant. I've found it helped me grow in empathy towards immigrants in the US, plus it's liberating to realize that you're not necessarily stuck with one government just because you were born there if another one attracts you more.

I noticed my mental health improved considerably when I moved. Admittedly, I was uniquely bothered in Atlanta for purely Atlantan and not necessarily generally American reasons, but it's something I gained so I note it here.

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