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Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

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141–150 of 474 posts

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#141

I've done it, and it was one of the best decisions of my life. WHERE: I'm Australian, moved to LA when I was 18 and lived there for 15 years. Then, I moved from Los Angeles to Germany (Duesseldorf), and then to Vienna, Austria. WHAT SACRIFICE: No more In 'n Out Burger, no more decent Mexican/TexMex food, no more LA food trucks. These are literally the only things I miss about the USA. Literally every other aspect of…

Vienna is one of the nicest and wealthiest cities in Europe. LA is a car-centric sprawling cesspool. Even for the US, it’s uniquely terrible. If you’d moved to some of the less desirable locations in Europe, you’d probably find them to be a shithole, too. Your lack of perspective (“how much of a shithole the USA really is”) is something I’d only expect from someone half your age on their first backpacking tour of Eur…

> LA is a car-centric sprawling cesspool. Even for the US, it’s uniquely terrible.

LA isn’t even the worst in that regard (I’d take LA over DFW)

I don’t know where you are from, but LA is actually representative of large swaths of the US, and highlights some of the best things about America (namely multiculturalism and diversity)

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#142
post #8

I was planning to move the other way before Covid - from Sweden to California. It's much less likely now as I have a stable position and my partner lost her job in the US. Mainly the US has many benefits: - Much, much higher salaries - like 2-3x higher than Western Europe _before_ income tax! - Much larger houses for the price. i.e. you can have a big house with room for hobbies or children rather than just a small f…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#143
post #15

I'm just outside London, moved here to marry my English wife from Vegas. I work part time doing basic IT for a US law firm due to health issues after heart surgery, and Yankee dollars are worth jack shit here - I'm not making serious tech industry money, but over here it's barely enough to survive on. Housing is always smaller than you'd get in (at least the western) US for the same price, and I'd bet that's true pre…

> brink of civil war I think that might be overstated. > NHS is absolutely amazing I've read and heard that for a non-emergency appointments, the wait could sometimes be months. Is that also overstated?

> I think that might be overstated.

You think correctly, this is sensationalist nonsense. Maybe a group of 0.05% of the population are in a bubble thinking their riots about stuff will constitute a civil war but by no means is there any sizable group wanting to protest aggressively.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious: how long since you moved out of USA? How long it took to learn German well enough (in your personal opinion) to integrate well?

20 years - I left just after 9/11, during which period I witnessed the USA collectively shitting itself, and during which I decided to play no part in the USA's continued economic survival. Far better to have moved to Germany and get things happening in a country not inclined to blood-lust because it was finally attacked the way it had been attacking countries, with impunity, for decades prior. The German culture's p…

Wow talk about rose colored glasses… history is longer than your lifetime my friend.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#145

Not from the US but from another country in the Americas. Here is a non-exhaustive list of things to take into consideration: - Social life. Yes, modern technology makes it easier than ever to keep touch with friends from across the globe, but you need to expect to lose some relationships there. Not all friendships can survive the distance. The time zone difference also makes it annoying to keep in touch (e.g. you wi…

Question about healthcare. You mentioned getting private healthcare. What is the purpose of that if public healthcare is available for free? Do you get to cut in line for appointments?

Shorter queues for non-essential procedures, nicer facilities (e.g. private rooms instead of wards), doctors who speak your language of preference, doctors available by videocall, healthcare whilst abroad included, that kind of thing.

Nothing strictly necessary, by definition, but lots of perks.

It's worth bearing in mind too that private healthcare is also _much_ cheaper in Europe than the US. In Spain for example I can get private healthcare + dental with zero copay for about €70 a month.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#146
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing expats definitely have to do is readjust their expectations about cost of living and relative expenses. While the payroll for your average European tech guy is nowhere near the stellar heights of the SV bro's, the buying power in Europe is at a level higher than you might expect. Whereas, for a single night out in SoCal I'd spend $100 - $150, dinner movie and drinks - here in Vienna I'd get through just as…

> You won't be buying million-dollar mansions on a European programmers salary You won't be buying any decent apartment/house unless you move outside of city, buy a car and let go of all the benefits that comes with living in a European city.

Not true at all. I know plenty of people that live in nice houses and apartments in major European cities.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#147
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Their comment was incredibly mild, and also accurate. Ironic that you're trying to convince people that Europeans are humble and kind.

They’re not European though, let’s not forget the zeal of the convert.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#148
I've done it and it's been a pretty wild ride that I would recommend it to anyone. I was originally born in Missouri and went right into the Army. That probably sounds like I was a country bumpkin, but I really wasn't.

After I left the military, I was drafted into an international company specializing in imports and exports. I learned several languages and my specialty was targeted negotiations. Eventually, even though I brought great value to the company, they decided that they no longer needed me and I was offered what seemed (to me) a pretty poor severance package.

This was a real turning point for me. I'd never been separated like that before -- I'd always moved on to new assignments on pretty good terms. Fortunately, I had a little set aside.

After a night of sailing in the Mediterranean, I had a horrific accident; I fell overboard and eventually rescued by a passing fishing vessel. As I healed, I sought to rebuild my life with the help of a few new friends, who I can now never forget.

Of note, even the larger U.S. consulates in Europe were not very kind or helpful! At times, it seemed almost like they were working against me. This may not reflect your experience, however. You're probably asking where the IRS was in all this, and to be honest I've asked myself the same question!

Where do you live?

I spend most of my time traveling and paying off old debts, but I do have a few close friends.

What's the biggest sacrifice you had to make (i.e., pay, housing, friends, etc.)

To be honest, there were people that I was very close to back in the States that I thought were my friends and people I could trust, but I found that most of them couldn't be trusted. Even my former colleagues seemed to not care for me that much. And traveling all the time is a bit of a pain, especially dealing with customs, local police, etc. My old company has blacklisted me, so I've got to deal with that as well.

What have you gained?

Freedom. Even though America is the land of opportunity, and actually I have determinedly pursued a lot of opportunities, some parts were quite miserable and even felt like torture, but I've mostly been able to suppress those feelings, even though they've left some lasting scars.

All told, my life has been pretty interesting, although the U.S. government has proven to me that it is really just a group of people like any other; even with the noblest of intentions, as you gather a large group of people, it becomes far more likely that some bad apples will infiltrate, so "the government" cannot always be trusted, even if it largely tries to do the right thing most of the time. Eventually, someone has to clean house.

I still respect those foundational principles of liberty and justice for all and still try to apply those principles.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#149
post #6

I can't answer all these questions, but I'm doing this right now. Moving from Denver, CO -> Berlin, Germany. I start in May. I'm taking about a 50% pay cut on paper (for a Senior Software Engineer position), although what's interesting is Berlin has a lower cost of living, and in particular rental prices are actually reasonable. My plan is for this to be a ~5 year thing, just because it would be hard to leave my fami…

> I'm taking about a 50% pay cut on paper (for a Senior Software Engineer position)

A friend of mine moved from Seattle to Munich for work as an SSE, and his experience with respect to the pay cut matches yours. He was expecting that, but did not factor in the increase in taxes on top of that. He said he was broke and living off savings for the first time in his adult life, while working 40 hours a week for a major software company.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious: how long since you moved out of USA? How long it took to learn German well enough (in your personal opinion) to integrate well?

20 years - I left just after 9/11, during which period I witnessed the USA collectively shitting itself, and during which I decided to play no part in the USA's continued economic survival. Far better to have moved to Germany and get things happening in a country not inclined to blood-lust because it was finally attacked the way it had been attacking countries, with impunity, for decades prior. The German culture's p…

I think the germans’ peaceful ways are more about compensating for what came before than about innate qualities of them as a people. The U.S. response to 9/11 was indeed abysmal, with no self-examination at all, and I know several people who since then refuse to travel to the U.S. because they basically consider the whole country to have gone mad. There is this very odd thing where if you talk to Americans they are mostly sane and reasonable people, and then you see their political system and it is like an episode of game of thrones.
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