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Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

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Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#91
post #15

I'm just outside London, moved here to marry my English wife from Vegas. I work part time doing basic IT for a US law firm due to health issues after heart surgery, and Yankee dollars are worth jack shit here - I'm not making serious tech industry money, but over here it's barely enough to survive on. Housing is always smaller than you'd get in (at least the western) US for the same price, and I'd bet that's true pre…

> Despite its reputation, I find that Europe is far more provincial than the US when it comes to food That might be an external reputation, but it wouldn't be one that Europeans would have. People forget that Europe isn't a country, but a collection of different countries, all with long histories, and long histories means a lot of regional differences even _within_ countries. > It is colder in most of Europe than the…

> For how far north everything is, Europe is positively _balmy_!

Thanks to the Gulf Stream. One potential risk of climate change is that if the circulation patterns are disrupted, our nice supply of warm water from the Atlantic might cease and it would actually get locally colder.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#93
post #6

I can't answer all these questions, but I'm doing this right now. Moving from Denver, CO -> Berlin, Germany. I start in May. I'm taking about a 50% pay cut on paper (for a Senior Software Engineer position), although what's interesting is Berlin has a lower cost of living, and in particular rental prices are actually reasonable. My plan is for this to be a ~5 year thing, just because it would be hard to leave my fami…

doing a similar thing this summer, moving from nyc to berlin

Good luck with apartment search!

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#95
US Southeast -> New York -> London

London driving is still necessary if you want to do anything out of town. It's super spread out and despite the Tube being reliable, it doesn't really run at night. London is so huge it's unlikely your friends will live much less than an hour away from you. The roads are tiny and civil engineering here post-dates most of the construction so it's mayhem compared to driving in the US. However, you can get the hang of it.

The NHS is great for (1) the bottom end, basic stuff with a straightforward solution like a broken arm and (2) the high-end emergency stuff like childbirth and cardiac arrest. Assuming you have reasonable health insurance in the US, the NHS falls flat for any kind of non-emergency, non-routine procedure. You'll need to pay retail to get the same care which is about 1.5x what the same procedure would cost cash in the US. Otherwise you'll learn the NHS's "holistic" solution to your problem. You will have the comfort of knowing the less well off aren't in dire straights paying for basic healthcare. If you think it's "free" though, see below.

Taxes are out of control. In addition to about a 50% income tax, most goods and services are also subject to a "value added tax" of 20%. Compensation is also about 60% of the US version. So in exchange for the NHS, you get an "everything is expensive" mentality, and it's super common to hear well-to-do folks complain about the slightest expenses. It's actually very socialist for being one of the largest capitalist democracies in the world.

The law here is much less clear, and somewhat "equity-based" although followed. For example, an individual has recently been convicted of the crime of owning the Anarchists Cookbook. Penalties are less severe.

Real estate costs are 1.5-2x those of an average US city and 1.25x those of New York. While new construction is made to last longer than its US counterparts, e.g., using a lot of brick, most of it has already lasted longer than its US counterpart. In other words, in London there isn't much new construction. Instead, it's a ton of 100+ year-old homes built with period materials and including 10, 20 and 30-year "extensions" strapped on.

The food is generally lackluster except a few categories like Indian. Forget pizza or Mexican food exists.

People are about as friendly as anywhere.

The weather is almost unbearable. It's always somewhat cloudy. There may be a few consecutive days in September that are clear, but any more than 3 and people will start complaining about how "it's boiling out". In the Summer, while it does warm up in direct sunlight, you don't get continental heating and the stable warm temperatures it brings. So you might find yourself wearing shorts out in the morning and wrapping up in a blanket later in the day. You'll note people wear lots of layers.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#96
post #57
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up in an American colony; the Canal Zone. We had our own schools and were taught U.S. curriculum and about the U.S. I was a rabid nationalist. I had never lived in the U.S. until I went to college but had visited it. Ever since coming to the U.S. I slowly became more and more liberal and less and less nationalistic. The myths I was taught about the U.S. did not withstand my experience of the country. Everythin…

> It’s very hard to live where you can walk to a grocery store. Very hard seems like an exaggeration. More expensive, maybe, but millions of low-income people also do it. I didn't have a car for most of my twenties, and the majority of my social group didn't either. Living in a more spread out area of the US is a choice-- one that comes with benefits, but still a choice.

I’ve lived in Florida, Kansas, Minnesota, and Indiana and visited over 40 states. Except in a few places my experience is that most people don’t live within walking distance of a car. Well, let me be more precise. Those who do live within walking distance to a grocery store tend to not have a pleasant enough or safe enough route to walk there to do so on a regular basis. Traversing a giant parking lot with a bunch of car drivers unaccustomed to pedestrians is unpleasant.

https://www.ers.usda.gov/amber-waves/2015/august/most-us-hou...

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#97

I've done it, and it was one of the best decisions of my life. WHERE: I'm Australian, moved to LA when I was 18 and lived there for 15 years. Then, I moved from Los Angeles to Germany (Duesseldorf), and then to Vienna, Austria. WHAT SACRIFICE: No more In 'n Out Burger, no more decent Mexican/TexMex food, no more LA food trucks. These are literally the only things I miss about the USA. Literally every other aspect of…

Being able to go on a road trip and end up in a different culture sounds awesome. I do that often in California, but there are only so many places you can go.

I absolutely love taking trips around the Balkans, and have been very lucky to have gotten quite familiar with Hungary, Slovenia, Croatia, Serbia and Kosovo in my recent travels. In a matter of hours, the universal constants (language, food, culture) have been replaced, and there are just so, so many beautiful things to discover in these countries. Words to blow ones minds, history that brings tears with a few simple footsteps...

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#98

I did the opposite and found the us much better. Pay and opportunities are infinitely better, people are friendlier, having a car is much easier and more convenient.

The first points are salient. The last point is interesting, since a car is generally much more required in the US, yes it is easier and more convenient to have a car in the US, as well as a buttload cheaper, but life without a car is (generally) a lot less easy or convenient.

The gas prices in the USA are pretty great compared to Europe (including during this presidency).

Some countries (like Italy) charge basically the cost of petrol in taxes.

On the cons, in the USA you generally need to drive longer distances.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#99
post #45
post #15

I'm just outside London, moved here to marry my English wife from Vegas. I work part time doing basic IT for a US law firm due to health issues after heart surgery, and Yankee dollars are worth jack shit here - I'm not making serious tech industry money, but over here it's barely enough to survive on. Housing is always smaller than you'd get in (at least the western) US for the same price, and I'd bet that's true pre…

> It's like a fucking Joy Division video here from October through April. :-D So people used to the Pacific Northwest would fit right in.

Yeah, unclear how this is relevant to the US->Europe topic.

Moving from LA to Minneapolis will be depressing, moving from Rome to London will too.

Re: Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20 years - I left just after 9/11, during which period I witnessed the USA collectively shitting itself, and during which I decided to play no part in the USA's continued economic survival. Far better to have moved to Germany and get things happening in a country not inclined to blood-lust because it was finally attacked the way it had been attacking countries, with impunity, for decades prior. The German culture's p…

> The German culture's proclivity for peace-making I had hitherto been unaware of this proclivity, thanks for educating us all.

You might want to pay a visit and get to know some modern Germans.
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