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Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

reuters.com

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Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#301

Post by adamcstephens »

rxhernandez wrote: post #155
N1H1L wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The midwest has some of the greatest engineering schools in the nation. I have been beating this drum hoarse for a few years now - but it's true. Specifically, members of the Big 10 conference are probably the best engineering schools conference in the world. Within 300 miles from Columbus (where you have Ohio State - Big10), you have Penn State, Michigan, Michigan State, UIUC, Indiana, Purdue from the Big 10 along w…

I'm sure there's more great ones in California but I can count 14 off the top of my head; I think all of them are nearly within 300 miles of LA too. 1. Caltech 2. Stanford 3. Cal 4. UCLA 5. Harvey Mudd 6. USC 7. UCSD 8. UCD 9. UCSB 10. CPSLO 11. UCI 12. CPP 13. UCSC 14. UCR

The other difference, which parent didn’t mention, is the Ohio has plenty of water.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#302

Post by outside1234 »

kragen wrote: post #242
hardolaf wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My undergraduate degree in ECE at OSU went far more in-depth on topics and set me up far better than the graduate programs at Purdue or UIUC do in their first year of graduate school. A huge part of that is that OSU's ECE department does not have senior-level courses. They only have senior/graduate courses. So the seniors are taking graduate level courses (when I went there, at least 4 were required to graduate). Als…

Purdue has a great reputation but I don't know anything about it personally except via Eugene Spafford. I may be biased because I like Scheme — SICP was a life-changing epiphany for me, and Essentials of Programming Languages was also quite revelatory — and Indiana has done a lot of inspiring Scheme work. I don't know of anything of similar importance from OSU but maybe they're really great in CPU design or subthresh…

Purdue is an engineering factory. It is both quality and quantity.

There were 1800 engineers in my graduating class (1995).

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#303

Post by nebula8804 »

gaoshan wrote: post #122

This is actually a brilliant location for them. One of those places that has much more going for it than people not from the region would realize. International airport, large rail depot, extremely low cost of living and a city/region that has more good restaurants and activities than might be expected. Ohio State University is in the city and is a huge school that is rapidly growing in academic standing. Road transi…

A smaller but still important metric....the possibility of turning it permanently blue? (one can hope)

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#304

Post by echelon »

mNovak wrote: post #255
mrfusion wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Low geopolitical risk is probably one of the best factors.

Fun fact, Ohio was supposedly high on the Soviet nuke target list, because of Wright Patterson AFB, which houses the Air Force Research Lab (and aliens). I have an old Soviet invasion map of central Ohio, marking all potential airfields etc.

> I have an old Soviet invasion map

Can you please post this? That sounds so interesting.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#305

Post by dillondoyle »

flybrand wrote: post #27
ksec wrote: post #15

Intel said the same thing for Arizona as well. Initial $20B investment which could expand to $100B. So they are building it in two places. I wonder why they dont keep it all in Arizona? ( May be Tax Break, but I have no idea how Tax Break works in US ) And if you include their (expected) expansion in EUR, Intel is layering the foundation for Foundry Services. Compared to its half assed Custom Foundry in 2012/2013 wit…

> why not all AZ? Game theory between US states playing to get the most gov’t assistance? Finite pool of talent? Our plants are in rural areas and everyone is struggling to hire, from auto to bakeries.

I agree about the game theory/race to the bottom as an incentive. I think there are more great reasons compounding these decisions that others point out too.

Large corporations love to hold cities and states hostage and make them bid against each other. AMZN is a great example with their campus 2 bidding war. I am glad NY had the cajones to stand up to them.

Most cities and states even have dedicated EcoDevo staff to actively seek out these companies.

Cities and states compete to give the largest tax benefits, usually something like you don't have to pay ___ taxes for __ years (like 10, worth tens of millions). Plus they'll spend on infrastructure and give preferential zoning, city regs, etc.

Sure having more jobs probably creates more incoming/housing taxes for the city.

But states like Texas win this race to the bottom (TSLA and Musk personally) and in my opinion the costs of these corporate incentives (imho handouts) are just passed along to citizens in the cost of less societal services and needs, less school funding, less everything. Just a funnel up.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#306

Post by outside1234 »

tourist_on_road wrote: post #268
hardolaf wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My undergraduate degree in ECE at OSU went far more in-depth on topics and set me up far better than the graduate programs at Purdue or UIUC do in their first year of graduate school. A huge part of that is that OSU's ECE department does not have senior-level courses. They only have senior/graduate courses. So the seniors are taking graduate level courses (when I went there, at least 4 were required to graduate). Als…

Something to note -- Indiana U doesn't have engineering stream unlike Purdue. Only thing close to engineering is computer science and Intelligent systems engineering.

Right - Indiana splits up subjects across universities so they can focus money. It is by design that Purdue is the engineering school and Indiana is the liberal arts school.

IU is a great liberal arts school - but doesn't compete in engineering by design.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#307

Post by abletonlive »

chasd00 wrote: post #232
mNovak wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on where they're moving from, they might take a pay cut.. Ohio is very cheap to live in. New Albany is not particularly exciting, but nearby Columbus is a nice vibrant city, not the end of the earth. OSU is a definitely good asset for Intel, they put out 2k engineering degrees a year. I hope this spurs a nice tech ecosystem for Ohio--it's been dominated by insurance and medicine for a long time.

given that over the last 2 years we've all been trained to live like hermits I wonder who is going to be bothered about lack of city amenities? You can still jog around the block and walk your dog but large public gatherings (big city specialty) isn't much of a draw any more.

sounds like you're living in a bubble. people in NYC are out and about socializing. not living like a hermit. there's like 50 dance events every weekend.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#308

Post by adamcstephens »

llbeansandrice wrote: post #267
hguant wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want to say so, but...so? At Intel scale, they're able to buy carbon offsets or - gasp! - install their own solar/wind in their properties. The municipal and state governments are I'm sure bending over backwards to get the plants and infrastructure investment, a permit to run whatever solar/wind/renewable they want is probably chump change for them.

I'll eat a sock if they bother with solar in Ohio. I guess it's better than nothing but large parts of Ohio just don't get that much sun. Wind is much more likely.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/amazon-behind-another-ohio...

I doubt socks are tasty, but please let us know.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#309

Post by totalZero »

qsmi wrote: post #67

Does anyone know why Intel would want to build a "mega-site" in the city of Columbus Ohio? Why not choose Cleveland Ohio where one has port access with an existing route to Europe? Fabs are international affairs, no matter where they're rooted, because just to keep the place running one needs a constant stream of parts from everywhere. It seems like being in a sea/rail/truck hub would be a logistics advantage. [1] ht…

New Albany is a suburb of the capital of the third most active manufacturing state in the US. Intel is courting the federal government for direct semiconductor industry support that goes beyond tax breaks on semiconductor fabrication equipment.

> Edit: On second thought, Arizona doesn't have port access either so I guess it's not really a significant consideration.

From a pure logistics perspective, I'd say that Arizona beats Ohio. BNSF connects Arizona with both the Pacific Ocean and the Gulf of Mexico. (Not to mention Lake Michigan.) It's impossible to drive Route 66 from California to Texas without rolling alongside extensive trains hauling cargo through the desert.

For me, the trains are one of the most scenic aspects of that drive.

LAX is the eighth-busiest air cargo terminal in the world, and it has plenty of cargo flights to Asia where computer devices are often assembled. PHX is also one of the busiest cargo airports in the United States, albeit much less so than LAX or CVG.

Fabs have massive physical plant inputs (eg. lithography machines), substantial commoditized manufacturing inputs (eg. boules/wafers, freshwater, industrial gas), and core outputs with small size and high value (ie. chips). The former two can be pipelined without knowing the exact product-by-product breakdown of customer demand, and the latter cannot.

Infrastructure and labor concerns might also tip the scales one way or another. Water supply, wastewater management, energy cost, grid resiliency, labor supply, access to institutions for professional training, and other considerations can differ wildly between the two regions.

Re: Intel's $20B Ohio factory could become world's largest chip plant

#310

Post by umvi »

gaoshan wrote: post #122

This is actually a brilliant location for them. One of those places that has much more going for it than people not from the region would realize. International airport, large rail depot, extremely low cost of living and a city/region that has more good restaurants and activities than might be expected. Ohio State University is in the city and is a huge school that is rapidly growing in academic standing. Road transi…

> extremely low cost of living and a city/region that has more good restaurants and activities than might be expected

That's what people said about Salt Lake City and Boise... until about 5 years ago. Cost of living has skyrocketed since 2017, housing alone has doubled in price. It doesn't take long for a low cost of living region to become high cost of living.

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