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Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

jasonstanford.substack.com

271–280 of 456 posts

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all a question of degree. A market with fewer taxes and less redistribution is freer.

This is only true if you're looking at the capital market. If you consider the labor market, I would argue it's freer if employees have more freedom to change jobs (i.e. there is some redistribution and social safety net). Edit: Also, a market with redistribution is more democratic. More actors have money to provide market input (demand or investment) when resources are not highly concentrated.

Free market doesn't mean that actors can do whatever they want. It means that the market has the power to allocate resources. In the labor market, the labor market allocated that employee to a job, and allocated a penalty to changing jobs, that the government in then changing.

Also, even in the labor market, the scenario you're describing is punishing the labor buyer but rewarding the labor provider, so it's not just the capital market that's less free, it's the labor market too.

More actors being able to provide input is restricting the markets. The market allocated who gets to provide input in itself.

All I'm saying is, don't fetishize the market being free.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#272
post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not twice as much work to sell a $2 million house as a $1 million house. Why does it cost twice as much in real estate agent fees?

In this case, so? Like I said, you're not being charged anything there. It comes out of the purchase price. It's the agent who is listing the house at a price and sourcing the various inspectors and appraisers. They're putting in the work to sell your house at a price point. So, if the agent can manage to move your house for $2 million rather than $1 million, why shouldn't they get a larger reward? It's a different s…

This assumes that any house can go for $2 million if you just get a good enough agent. That’s clearly not the case. If there was some way to pay for excess returns, that would be a good argument. But flat commission percentage isn’t it.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#273
> And with the stock market at an all-time high, corporate profits soaring, and CEO pay exponentially higher than their workers, execs can afford to share the wealth a bit.

Executive pay makes up a tiny fraction of the total salary expense of a large corporation. Even redistributing the entire salary of the CEO among workers will have no impact whatsoever.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#274

I see that many are fixed on tips, but I found it quite shocking to read about long queues of people on the Christmas day and people quitting on the Christmas Eve. In many European cities, the streets are completely empty and almost all shops (maybe a local supermarket would open from 10:00 till 14:00 on a Christmas day after being closed for the Eve) are closed both on the Christmas Eve and the Christmas day.

Just give it time until europe reaches late stage capitalism. Yes, they didn't have as many neoliberal waves eroding the social fabric in name of capitalism.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this Reddit comment from a use called TheMagecite on parenting during the pandemic might get to some of it: "No. So lets take my example I have two children one has autism. What my son desperately needs is social interaction, how do you teach social interaction well without peers? He can't see other children and right now he has such limited exposure to other children he is about to start school and it is a n…

This is where the overprotective nature of American parenting comes to bite you: your kid will be fine playing with other kids outside, why not… do it?

Not necessarily. Kids with poor social skills get bullied.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#276

I wonder why all the comments from this thread exclusively about tips when the article covered much much more than that. Interesting.

I suspect a lot of people here have never worked the kinds of jobs being talked about. It's basically bikeshedding. Tips are easy to talk about and the rest isn't.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, I've never even considered tipping at Starbucks.

Interesting. I tip at Starbucks always but almost never at Dunks. I have no fully acceptable-to-me rational explanation for this arbitrary-seeming difference. I can concoct a backwards justification, but I very rarely go to either, so I haven't had to unravel this mystery.

Those arbitrary-seeming differences are everywhere once you try to justify who gets tips and who doesn’t. Pretty much every justification of why tips are great applies to jobs that don’t get tips, and vice versa.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I naively thought the whole point of the market was to effectively route resources to where they are most in demand and allow innovation from the ground up where it's needed without central planning

It is. Free markets do not preclude social safety nets, or things like universal basic income.

In fact, if you want the labour market to be a free market, universal basic income will help; then you've got a market where people can always say no to a deal they don't like. When the choice becomes: take the shitty deal or starve, it's not really a free market anymore.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#279
post #143

It's a shame that the comments here are laser focused on the tipping parts of the article, and not the bigger picture items. The author outlines the struggles of getting service jobs filled in high CoL areas, the vicious cycle of turnover in these jobs, and all the commenters here want to discuss is the 2 paragraphs on tipping.

Besides the author’s v points about the poor working conditions, I was struck by the points about transit costs. I am curious how much of the current labor situation in the US can be explained by the combination of 1) geographic wealth segregation —- richer consumers clustering together while generally poorer service workers have to live far away —- and 2) high gas prices / underdeveloped public transit. At some poin…

Public transit in Austin is terrible, and nonexistent in the suburbs. And there is a lot of wealth (and racial) housing segregation in Austin. I'd say you hit the nail on the head for Austin, at least. Speaking as someone who grew up in Austin poor without a car, and lived there until adulthood. Now work at a FAANG in a city much lower cost of living.

Re: Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now

#280

Former politician who focused on labor joins the workforce and learns the real truth THEN chastises customers for not tipping in the conclusion of his article? Yes, he talks about the tough conditions of the job and customer behavior and other things, but nothing about how MAYBE legislation should change for wages (hourly service workers relying on tips in the US actually make well below the hourly minimum wage). Sor…

The title of the article ("He thought tending bar sounded like fun. Then the entire kitchen staff quit on Christmas Eve"), the NH submission title ("Former Labor Secretary Found What Work Is Like Now") and your comment ("...joins the workforce and learns the real truth") make it sounds like the author experienced some deep revelation about the state of this kind of work. I think the titles are a bit hyperbolic (to ba…

Agree that the titles may distort the perception (you make an excellent point), but I was concerned about the conclusion of the article. Thank you for bringing that to light.

I also respect your reading of the article as a generalization of this predicament. This is also very helpful to reframe the article. But personally, I'm not so sure of that entirely. And that's because he's outlining tip practices, a voluntary operation, while offering no real conclusion beyond his observations (which I agree are universal) besides "please tip more." I would have also liked (unfairly expected?) someone who said "I have pretty much been in politics my whole adult life" to filter through that lens - policy enablement of the situation.

From the end of the article:

"As for customers… You want to see Spider Man? You desperately want to bring your kids to Encanto or Sing 2? And you want your popcorn, food, and drinks? Cool. But if you don’t tip or act like an asshole, taking your personal anger and frustrations on workers who don’t deserve it, workers will not be there to serve you.

"Good old Adam Smith and his invisible hand of supply and demand works both ways, and the reason why you won’t get what you want will be staring right back in the mirror."

I agree with the author: don't be an a$$hol3 is a good life principle. I actually agree people should tip, too, for good service. What I don't agree with is that, as a legislator, you should craft policy and policy enforcement around the concept of goodwill. Goodwill is a societal outcome of policy, not a requirement of policy. Especially when wellbeing through wage earning is at stake.

Also, supply and demand does work both ways, as the author says. Will policy be able to keep up? Meaning, if demand for workers increases, we should see adjustments in wages. Yet the "rely on tipping, take a lower wage" policy remains with know conditions of the system (that people might not tip).

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