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Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

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Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#91
post #17
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Norton 360, which if memory serves has been a stalwart of the preinstall game now installs an opt-in Cryptominer. https://krebsonsecurity.com/2022/01/norton-360-now-comes-wit...

Further evidence that crypto is truly a cancer on software.

> Further evidence that crypto is truly a cancer on software.

Yes, on the bastion of healthy software that is...third party antivirus(!?)

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#92
post #2

More than likely, because switching to Linux also drops all the "paid pre-installed windows software" (companies paying Dell to pre-install their software) then this jump in price would give a hint as to how much Dell receives in payment for pre-installing all those windows extras.

A friend of mine worked with systems like this - and this was decades ago - said the pre-installed deals were very lucrative. decades ago it was > $50/machine

Nowadays there's also the automated data-collection, remote telemetry and troubleshooting, "know your customer", etc.

That said, the remote lenovo stuff is a whole different level

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s like why alcohol free beer costs almost same in NZ - because they have to take out alcohol!

That's why I find the power of ads and marketing truly fearsome. Why buy alcohol free alcoholic beverages?

It does taste nice and goes well with many foods.

When Lithuania banned sales on Sunday after 3PM the sales of it skyrocketed. IIRC NZ grown 100% lately too. Many people choose it when they drive.

I like my 9% IPA's but when I have to drive or there's bbq party middle of the day I'll go for low alcohol ones.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s like why alcohol free beer costs almost same in NZ - because they have to take out alcohol!

Alcohol-free beers have their alcohol removed through vacuum distillation - the only reason it's not more expensive than beer is probably because there is no alcohol taxation on the product.

Alcohol is super expensive in NZ, exactly due to alcohol tax.

Right now 12pack of 330ml alcohol free Heineken goes for $23 NZD while alcoholic one is $22.

I remember paying €5 ($8 NZD) for 20pack or so of cheap stuff in Netherlands.

Cost to manufacture is negligible, really. Probably smallest part when looking at bottling and distribution.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#95

Just take advantage of the Windows-environment subsidies. Save yourself a few bucks. Buy the system with the Windows OS. Back up the OS to a USB thumb drive and store it away carefully. You may need that to reinstall Windows if you want to sell the machine off a year or two later. Wipe the hard drive completely by installing a new partition table. Install your own favorite Linux distro. Almost invariably, the Linux d…

I was able to install Windows onto a laptop that had been running Ubuntu only for years without any trouble using just a Windows installer USB. You don't need to save the original image, especially given it's full of crapware.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#96
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

honestly since 20.04 ubuntu or so, nvidia works pretty well on linux (other than battery life on laptops which is still not good).

If all you need is a framebuffer, nvidia is fine. However I regularly run into 3d applications that either only run (either at all, or without significant artifacts) with nouveau or only run with the nvidia binary drivers. I reboot fairly regularly just to switch between the two.

huh, that hasn't been my experience at all. I don't play a ton of demanding games, but pretty much everything I have played (on 1440p monitor, RTX 2060) is capable of hitting framecaps.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#97
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all you need is a framebuffer, nvidia is fine. However I regularly run into 3d applications that either only run (either at all, or without significant artifacts) with nouveau or only run with the nvidia binary drivers. I reboot fairly regularly just to switch between the two.

huh, that hasn't been my experience at all. I don't play a ton of demanding games, but pretty much everything I have played (on 1440p monitor, RTX 2060) is capable of hitting framecaps.

Maybe my card is to old? 1050Ti

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#98
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I find the power of ads and marketing truly fearsome. Why buy alcohol free alcoholic beverages?

If you like the taste but don't want the negative parts, or if you don't want alcohol but want to feel "included" ( e.g. muslims, recovering alcoholics or just people who don't like getting "buzzed").

Included?

If you've made the choice to not drink, is the next logical step to buy a non-alcoholic alcoholic beverage?

Seems a bit more than silly.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#99
post #65
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Further evidence that crypto is truly a cancer on software.

If Norton 360 installed Folding@home, would you call F@H a "cancer"? No, you wouldn't. The true cancer here is pre-installed antivirus software such as Norton.

F@H is using the energy for something useful. I don't view the creation of a digital speculative asset as useful in the same way I view scientific research (something terribly underfunded as-is)

Crypto is a cancer even when users voluntarily participate, but that's a separate discussion. It's incredibly inefficient and I distrust anyone downplaying the severity of fragmented commerce networks that individually use more energy than entire countries with millions of fungible flesh and blood humans.

Re: Ask HN: Why the $200 Overhead on Dell XPS Laptops with Linux?

#100
post #84
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this scenario, would Norton be taking a 15% cut?

Yes, what if they did? In fact what if they resold 100% of the F@H compute power to buyers? That argument doesn't lead where you want it to go. It's the antivirus companies that are rubbish.

Then it wouldn't be F@H, you'd be part of Norton's botnet. It's not just the AV companies, uTorrent had a controversy around the same thing. All about making a quick buck and crypto is enabling it by getting people to buy in to what is essentially a botnet
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