Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 380 posts

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#121

Post by ClumsyPilot »

jeffbee wrote: post #104
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we are removing all jurors who have been abused because they are 'not impartial', aren't we left with a collection of people who are totally ignorant? The jury has to judge how a reasonable person would act in a certain situation, who is lying and who is telling the truth. Off one end, we have victim blamind and rapists walking free, off another end, uk had "serial liar" who invented false rape allegations and sen…

The whole jury system in founded on ignorance. Both sides don't want anyone who was a cop, knows any cops, has studied the law, or was ever arrested. Often, people with any kind of higher education will be dismissed. Last time I went to jury duty they asked anyone who had ever been party to any legal matter to leave. It's pretty wild.

I feel this case goes even further than the examples given. Not very familiar with US system, but suppose we had a case of a bar braul, would we ask anyone who has ever had a fight to leave?

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#122

Post by ars »

Syonyk wrote: post #108
zozbot234 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mike Pence rule. Don't ever be alone with a vulnerable person without a neutral third party being present, it wreaks havoc on the threat-detection instinct. As the saying goes, "you're not paranoid if someone really is out to get you."

Billy Graham was the originator of the concept in his ministry [0]. Not only does it help prevent things from happening that could be a problem later, it helps prevent even accusations of such, if it's well known that the person involved holds to this rule and expects others to hold them to it as well. Say what you will about Pence, love him or hate him, nobody is accusing him of sexual misconduct - and that's the po…

It's much much much older than that, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yichud

It doesn't prevent abuse by a close family member though.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#123

Post by jerf »

woodruffw wrote: post #105
deanCommie wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the very premise of trying to find an "impartial" jury very strange. It makes sense at first pass, but falls apart soon after. Are these not to be a jury of my "peers". Are not all humans biased in one way or another. If being abused creates bias, why wouldn't NOT being abused also not create bias. We don't have perfect access to information. Sometimes in order to be considered impartial, jurors are basically…

Impartiality in a jury trial context doesn't refer to the absence of biases (we all have them and truly getting rid of them is an impossible task), but a conscious effect by the jurors to discharge their office without prejudice , i.e., without allowing their biases to manifest as judgments independent of the evidence presented in court. Put another way: there wouldn't be a point in deliberation if we didn't have bia…

And to put it another way, the job of a juror is to convict or exonerate the person on trial, not to convict or exonerate their own abusers by proxy.

Vulcans might not have a problem with this, but humans so obviously do that pretending otherwise is impractical.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#124

Post by bArray »

sandworm101 wrote: post #28

I find this to be the most telling stat: "In a few cases (N So roughly 5% (<5 of 84) of the control group were discovered to have themselves been abused and needed to be dropped from the study. I was once in a law lecture on medical ethics. We were discussing genetic testing of newborns and how this could detect incest/abuse. A medical doctor in the class was dead against such testing. In his experience, amongst preg…

> So roughly 5% (I hope this is accidental bias, or a statistical anomaly. It could be for example that this is overrepresented from the pooled community. I think it would also be important to somehow scale/categorize the level of abuse (physical vs non-physical, penetrative vs non-penetrative, etc).

If it really is 5% (1 in 20 girls) then this would outrank something like COVID in terms of importance.

> The comparison sample (n = 82) was recruited via advertisements in community newspapers and posters in welfare, daycare, and community facilities in the same neighborhoods in which the abused participants lived. Comparison families contacted study personnel and were screened for eligibility, which included having no prior contact with protective service agencies and being demographically similar to a same-aged abused participant. At the time of study entry, comparison families were not informed that the study involved sexually abused females; rather, they were told that the study was of “female growth and development.”

I wonder whether this still ended up being a self-selecting group. I can imagine a scenario where a young girl has an awful experience growing up, wants to see change in the upbringing of females and becomes somewhat engaged in related activities.

> He actually said: You better build some more prisons before you start testing babies for this.

I don't think a lack of facilities to deal with a problem is a good reason for not addressing it. At the very least we need to understand the scale of the problem, even if the problem remains unaddressed for the time being.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#125

Post by Mezzie »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #97
fullstop wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

If we are removing all jurors who have been abused because they are 'not impartial', aren't we left with a collection of people who are totally ignorant? The jury has to judge how a reasonable person would act in a certain situation, who is lying and who is telling the truth. Off one end, we have victim blamind and rapists walking free, off another end, uk had "serial liar" who invented false rape allegations and sen…

Or, you know, abusers.

Which I consider a larger problem. Since so much abuse is hidden, the perpetrators also can sit on juries related to sexual assault cases. Delightful.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#126

Post by wnolens »

ejiwgnalsocn wrote: post #44

[trigger warning] I'm a woman. I was physically and sexually abused by my father as a child. The impact it's had on me is painful to describe. I was working as a software engineer in the tech industry and was constantly experiencing PTSD symptoms being surrounded by men -- though by no fault of their own, it was totally because of what my father did to me. It's been a frustrating journey. The sexual abuse happened to…

Thanks for sharing. It really does make a difference.

Most people's guess as to the rate of occurrence of this kind of abuse would be off by an order of magnitude or more.

In the past 5 years I've become privy to so many dark experiences of close female friends and family. What used to be an outlier experience is now almost.. common? More than one woman I've dated has had to preface intimacy with a harrowing experience. It's been hard for me to deal with this knowledge about people I love, but nevertheless is the truth and must be told.

Take care. I hope the remote work world has helped.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#128

Post by sandworm101 »

bArray wrote: post #124
sandworm101 wrote: post #28

I find this to be the most telling stat: "In a few cases (N So roughly 5% (<5 of 84) of the control group were discovered to have themselves been abused and needed to be dropped from the study. I was once in a law lecture on medical ethics. We were discussing genetic testing of newborns and how this could detect incest/abuse. A medical doctor in the class was dead against such testing. In his experience, amongst preg…

> So roughly 5% ( I hope this is accidental bias, or a statistical anomaly. It could be for example that this is overrepresented from the pooled community. I think it would also be important to somehow scale/categorize the level of abuse (physical vs non-physical, penetrative vs non-penetrative, etc). If it really is 5% (1 in 20 girls) then this would outrank something like COVID in terms of importance. > The compari…

We don't have hard numbers on kids, but we have some very solid numbers from young adults.

From 2020 Statistics Canada study of university students:

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/85-002-x/2020001/article...

>> One in ten (11%) women students experienced a sexual assault in a postsecondary setting during the previous year. About one in five (19%) women who were sexually assaulted said that the assault took the form of a sexual activity to which they did not consent after they had agreed to another form of sexual activity—for example, agreeing to have protected sex and then learning it had been unprotected sex.

>> Less than one in ten women (8%) and men (6%) who experienced sexual assault, and less than one in ten women (9%) and men (4%) who had experienced unwanted sexualized behaviours spoke about what happened

Given that last stat, we should take whatever number we have for reported assaults' and multiply it by at least ten to cover all the unreported events.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#129

Post by Mezzie »

fullstop wrote: post #71
sandworm101 wrote: post #28

I find this to be the most telling stat: "In a few cases (N So roughly 5% (<5 of 84) of the control group were discovered to have themselves been abused and needed to be dropped from the study. I was once in a law lecture on medical ethics. We were discussing genetic testing of newborns and how this could detect incest/abuse. A medical doctor in the class was dead against such testing. In his experience, amongst preg…

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

> This isn't something that I have to personally worry about if I'm by myself, but it's something that so many women do have to worry about all the time. I can't even imagine the burden that women must carry.

Not just women, but children. I was aware that I could be sexually assaulted/harrassed and what to do about it by the time I was 5, and I started getting uncomfortable comments in person around age 11. I'm also exceptionally lucky and have never actually been assaulted.

Not particularly relevant to most people here, but some of you will have daughters, so.

Edit: Also relevant potentially to your colleagues and co-workers, since one reason I stopped participating in tech spaces while I was a teenager (I still coded, just only alone or anonymously) was because I felt unsafe being a 13-14 year old girl who was the only female in a room/space with dozens of men, some of whom were 2-3 times my age. I don't think I can overstate the danger alarm bells, especially given how rampant homophobia was back then and I was also gay.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#130

Post by throwanem »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #110
fullstop wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seems like a hell of a leap. What are the odds someone is being abused concurrent with jury duty vs any other time in their life up until that point? Not really. In abusive relationships, the abuser often controls every aspect of the abused person's life and there are not opportunities to seek help without the abuser knowing. It's why there are sometimes signs in the bathrooms of women's health clinics informing th…

We've all heard that cliched phrase about the word "assume." This happened in a courthouse, not a hospital. I think the context of the discussion behind closed doors could have just as easily been "that is so bad you really need to consider reporting it" or even something more mundane. In any case, seems a little farcical to assume that meant she was actively being abused though it certainly seems like a decent one o…

A notable trait of courthouses is that they are very frequently attended by law enforcement officers to whom such a report could be made.

Especially given how little interest court personnel typically take in individual panelists, why assume everyone with whom you're putting so much effort into arguing is so probably wrong in our analysis of what this interaction likely was?

Post reply on HN