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The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

edit: deleted, not worth trying to add any discussion to a topic like this.

Why not? It's not as if the exemption questionnaire on the back of the summons has a checkbox for it.

I've been called for jury duty any number of times. Not once has anyone ever called me, personally, out of one room and into another - always as part of a group of selectees heading to a courtroom or voir dire or whatever. Between that and everything else, it doesn't seem like a leap at all.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#92
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chilling but also a little reassuring. If you are a victim, knowing that a large percentage of the population has also been abused can help recovery. It says that it is very possible to be a victim and go on to a normal life. Want something very chilling? First year criminal law lecture on rape. Professor says "We have about a hundred people in this room. None of you future lawyers have criminal records. Statisticall…

Interesting how she assumed none of the men would be raped. Newer CDC stats (since ~2010 when they started asking men if they've ever been "made to penetrate" by a woman) show that female-on-male rape happens a lot more often than people think. https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2016/11/the-unde...

I had that discussion with her. She was actually an open lesbian, part of the early gay marriage push in new england. At the time (early 2000s) there were some states with old laws that also made female-on-female rape physically impossible. Canada recently abolished "rape" as a distinct crime, instead placing it on the far end of a sexual assault spectrum. I think this is probably the best way forwards.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

If they came back in tears and were removed from the jury, then the system worked. A clearly impartial potential juror was removed and a past victim was saved from a horrible experience of sitting through such testimony. But what about those who have been abused but aren't in tears? This came up very recently. One of the Ghislaine Maxwell jurors discussed his history of being abused with other jurors. The question be…

I find the very premise of trying to find an "impartial" jury very strange. It makes sense at first pass, but falls apart soon after.

Are these not to be a jury of my "peers". Are not all humans biased in one way or another. If being abused creates bias, why wouldn't NOT being abused also not create bias. We don't have perfect access to information. Sometimes in order to be considered impartial, jurors are basically expected to have no familiarity with basic fundamental news stories. Are people so disconnected from reality really "peers"?

Ultimately, I guess, it's the best we can do.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

edit: deleted, not worth trying to add any discussion to a topic like this.

Abuse is often ongoing for long periods of time, so I don't know that it's necessarily implausible.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#95
post #33

Can testify it does a number on male development too

Interestingly, there's another child comment, flagged and dead [edit: it has been resurrected], that says simply, "Sh...no-one cares about men." It's not a great comment, as it lacks substance, but it reflects something real and important. Sexual abuse is to women as police violence is to black people. These classes of people are affected more (far more - perhaps 2x?) than others, but that doesn't mean others aren't…

The initial comment here adds to the discussion of the impact on female development, without making a grandiose claim that no one cares.

Both your comment and the flagged comment make that claim.

It seems much more so the case that people can care about how bad actions affect both female and male victims than the hypothesis you propose.

And, in fact, straight white men can be in a position of power, and have advantages, and also be able to share stories where they are victims, and find support. These things do not have to be black and white and contradictory.

Who the victim is and how they are affected does not speak about who the transgressor is, nor does it do so in inflexible, absolute terms. So the effects of being a victim can be explored without going into a "victim mentality" as someone who does not happen to be the primary focus of this article.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a man, is there anything I can do or avoid doing in the workplace to make it easier for coworkers like you? Let's assume I don't know and don't suspect anything specific about my coworkers. I just want to know if there's anything that would be pretty easy to implement, that would make a difference.

Fellow man, here, but I think I have something of value to add: Learning to be open and friendly, and developing a sense for when someone doesn't want to talk to me has been an important part of growing up. I try to identify signals that a person wants to end their interaction with me, and respect their wishes immediately and in a friendly way.

Being "open and friendly" is no good when someone literally has shell shock(!) (aka PTSD) from interacting with people like you. You'll need to behave in such a way as to demonstrate to them that they can intuitively and securely trust you not to be an immediate physical threat, nor to pose any in the foreseeable future.

The quick rule-of-thumb is to be courteous and respectful but also establish very firm physical boundaries, even erring towards being less friendly as opposed to more. You also need to proactively signal that you will stop interacting with them at the slightest sign of their discomfort; keeping interactions short and to the point is an obvious way to do this, even though this outwardly looks "rude" and "unfriendly"!

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#97

I find this to be the most telling stat: "In a few cases (N So roughly 5% (<5 of 84) of the control group were discovered to have themselves been abused and needed to be dropped from the study. I was once in a law lecture on medical ethics. We were discussing genetic testing of newborns and how this could detect incest/abuse. A medical doctor in the class was dead against such testing. In his experience, amongst preg…

My wife was summoned for jury duty, and the case had to do with sexual abuse. At jury selection time they ask if a prospective juror would have difficulty being impartial because of the nature of the case. If you were uncomfortable discussing the matter, you could ask to be taken aside to discuss without the others in the room hearing it. Out of a few dozen people, seven women left the room to explain why they could…

If we are removing all jurors who have been abused because they are 'not impartial', aren't we left with a collection of people who are totally ignorant?

The jury has to judge how a reasonable person would act in a certain situation, who is lying and who is telling the truth.

Off one end, we have victim blamind and rapists walking free, off another end, uk had "serial liar" who invented false rape allegations and sent 9 innocent people to jail.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always a fascinating Alt-History scenario to me: what if the patriarchal societies didn’t win out early on? How drastically different would history had become?

There's a fantastic (and quite funny!) French film "I'm Not An Easy Man"[1] that sort of explores this idea but from the perspective of what society would look like today if gender roles were flipped. I think it's available on Netflix. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Am_Not_an_Easy_Man

thanks for the recommendation

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#99

I find this to be the most telling stat: "In a few cases (N So roughly 5% (<5 of 84) of the control group were discovered to have themselves been abused and needed to be dropped from the study. I was once in a law lecture on medical ethics. We were discussing genetic testing of newborns and how this could detect incest/abuse. A medical doctor in the class was dead against such testing. In his experience, amongst preg…

"In a few cases (N I think you are misinterpreting. First, they say:

"...information was obtained about any possible unwanted sexual experiences of the comparison females or other family members"

So interpreting it as 5 of 84 women is incorrect. It's min 5 people of 84 families. Given a mean family size of perhaps 3.5 (if by "family" they mean "nuclear family", though I bet they include anyone you know about really--Uncle Bob would count, and one report per family with reports) it's more like 5 out of 294 people, or 1.7%. And I don't think they share their exclusion criteria, which isn't a good sign. And there's a significant selection bias given how they recruited (in a newspaper, for people who have the free time and/or low wealth enough to want to do a study, and in particular on female growth and development).

I think your comment is getting attention because you're offering an idea that people like, and some anecdata to back it up. It's a classic problem of the modern world, things that people want to believe get a lot of attention, out of proportion to their actual frequency. I think you, and others here, want to believe the situation is worse than it is, or worse than the data here warrant believing, because you're going to get rewarded for acting as if the appealing idea is the case. I don't mean you are sitting there, consciously thinking that, but the rewards (here some updoots on HN) shape your behavior behind the scenes anyway. This is how we get news that paints a grotesquely distorted view of the world: people want to hear about how a crazed soccer mom murdered all her kids in the bathtub, and critically it is profitable. They don't want to hear that everything was fine in Peoria, IL last night.

I would bet a lot of money that the picture you paint with the study's numbers is substantially false. For one, your interpretation of the numbers they give is wrong. Second, the study doesn't appear well done. It's a little old, but it also has a lot of indicators that it isn't of high quality (e.g., lots of "p<0.05", but no "p<0.001"--see p curves). I haven't read it in detail and won't because my spidey senses say it's not worth it based on what I've seen skimming.

Re: The impact of sexual abuse on female development: a longitudinal study

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't doctors mandatory reporters in the United States?

Their primary directive legal or not is to uphold the oath they took to do no harm. If reporting would cause them to violate this ancient creed then it is for they to decide what they will do.

Sure, if they want to risk being stripped of their license, they can flout the law.
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