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Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

inc.com

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Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#11

Post by Bud »

thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Might be good to read the patents before posting this comment. The patents in the suit are far, far more detailed than Inc's throwaway one-line description in this article. Sonos' tech here also involves seamless automatic wireless setup and automatically assessing relative speaker volume for a given space, and all kinds of other things. If you've set up a group of Sonos speakers, versus any of the competitors, you know how much better their tech is.

It's not merely "ability to connect speakers in groups". Inc just did a terrible job here.

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#13

Post by Bud »

nailer wrote: post #4
thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Came here to say the same thing. I'm the last fan of Google but "the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume" is obvious to conceive of and implement to any engineer with sufficient expertise in the field.

It's not obvious at all, for wireless speakers, especially in complex multi-room setups. If it were obvious and easy, then everyone's wireless audio products would handle this as well as Sonos does. But they don't. I bought two Sonos One SLs and had them set up as a stereo pair that my Apple TV could talk to almost instantly. Then recently I got a Sonos Beam soundbar and wanted to use my One SLs as surround speakers. I expected a long, painful setup similar to what I've experienced with competing products. Instead it was seamless, easy, and delightful, and I haven't had to touch or mess with the setup at all since.

There are also a lot of details like how to handle time delays with a large set of wireless speakers so that sound is synced with a TV picture, comparative volume adjustments for a given acoustic, etc.

Did you read the patents or any other reporting on the patents or this case? For instance:

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/01/in-a-flashpoint-for-...

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/01/google-loses-sonos-p...

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#14

Post by smichel17 »

nailer wrote: post #4
thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Came here to say the same thing. I'm the last fan of Google but "the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume" is obvious to conceive of and implement to any engineer with sufficient expertise in the field.

Or to anyone who uses an old-fashioned audio receiver ("amp") with wired speakers. Turn the dial, both speakers change volume. Obviously what I want.

I have not read anything besides this article, though, so it's possible the patent is being misinterpreted here.

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#15

Post by jdavis703 »

nailer wrote: post #4
thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Came here to say the same thing. I'm the last fan of Google but "the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume" is obvious to conceive of and implement to any engineer with sufficient expertise in the field.

Sound engineers and technicians have been controlling speaker group volume for probably a century now. The Sonos patent is more than just an obvious invention. Otherwise the courts would’ve tossed it out.

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#16

Post by RealityVoid »

You know what, this is bullshit. They are making the customers pay for Google's problems. This is unacceptable, what blame do they have for the IP troubles? Google should pay, if it's deemed to be infringing, but the functionality should stay the same for the customer. Imagine this, someone coming to your house to hobble your product's functionality because another company sued the company you bought the product from.

This is proof of lacking customer protection and leverage.

I think Sonos's case is bullshit anyway, and I think this whole patent environment is ridiculous, but the approach they took to solve it is unethical.

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#18

Post by nosianu »

Sorry, but for this link I only get

  404 Page Not Found
  We're sorry for any inconvenience.
  We can't find the page you're looking for.
I would not say anything if it said "blocked for your IP/country", but it appears there is nothing any more behind that link. Was the article removed?

EDIT: Ad-blocker (uBlock Origin) off and the page loads. I should have thought of that, there was a flicker of something else before the "not found". Still very strange to show a "404 Not Found" in retaliation for an ad-blocker instead of complaining about the latter.

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#19

Post by davweb »

Bud wrote: post #11
thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Might be good to read the patents before posting this comment. The patents in the suit are far, far more detailed than Inc's throwaway one-line description in this article. Sonos' tech here also involves seamless automatic wireless setup and automatically assessing relative speaker volume for a given space, and all kinds of other things. If you've set up a group of Sonos speakers, versus any of the competitors, you k…

One the relevant patents [1] does just appear to be describing connecting speakers in a group.

[1]: https://patents.google.com/patent/US8588949B2/en

Re: Google doesn't want to pay Sonos for technology it copied

#20

Post by mattmcknight »

Bud wrote: post #11
thatguy0900 wrote: post #3

I really wish there would be some kind of overhaul in patents. Why was a patent for "The technology in question relates to the ability to connect speakers in groups and control their volume." ever granted? That seems like the very first thing you would do when connecting two speakers. Unless this is some kind of ai that tracks where you are and dynamically changes volumes to maintain a surround sound feel or somethin…

Might be good to read the patents before posting this comment. The patents in the suit are far, far more detailed than Inc's throwaway one-line description in this article. Sonos' tech here also involves seamless automatic wireless setup and automatically assessing relative speaker volume for a given space, and all kinds of other things. If you've set up a group of Sonos speakers, versus any of the competitors, you k…

If the patent didn't cover adjusting the volume for a group of speakers, why did Google have to disable it? While the patent portfolio did include other things, Google is being forced to disable the basic, obvious feature.
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