More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’ • Hacker News Board

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#801

Post by a45a33s » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:29 PM UTC

rhino369 wrote: post #452

afavour wrote: post #129

I'm vaxxed. I'm boosted. I'd very much like to be done. But my children cannot be vaccinated. As a parent of a young kid it kind of feels like everyone has just moved on. I know folks in here will tell me that statistically speaking my children are unlikely to be hospitalized and so on, and I agree. But I know enough kids who got COVID and suffered the symptoms (e.g. a months-long scratchy cough) that I'm not going t…

You'll drive yourself crazy focusing on every minor risk for children. COVID risk for unvaxed kids is the same as fully vaxed 40 years and much lower than fully vaxed seniors. If you want to do some productive worrying, figure out how to reduce your child's risk of dying in a car crash. That's much more of a risk. >Moderna was supposed to close out a trial in late November but instead expanded it to hundreds of new p…

lol well they already got rid of the control group at the beginning of the original trials

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#802

Post by andrewclunn » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:29 PM UTC

So many commentators who say, "Your suffering is an indication that the vaccine worked!" or "That's the exception that proves, the rule! Look at this science!" when people raise concerns with the objectivity of our scientific institutions themselves. I am having a hard time distinguishing between these people and the thousands of CPP affiliated commenters that come on every YouTube video related to Chinese propaganda and policy. Here's a much better quote for this situation:

"Who are you gonna believe, me or your own eyes?" - Groucho Marx

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#803

Post by standardUser » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:32 PM UTC

spookthesunset wrote: post #768

BoysenberryPi wrote: post #507

I don't want to talk about vaccines anymore. Whatever study people have to cherry pick or whatever beliefs you may hold, whatever your stance is, most people have made the decision on whether or not to be vaccinated. What I wish we focused on instead, is the medical system as a whole. We've been hearing stories everyday about how hospitals are on the brink of collapse. Why, in 2 years of this pandemic, have we not de…

If the virus is endemic, what even is the point of all this testing? What does is accomplish besides telling you “yup, this test says you have a virus”? I never got tested for respiratory viruses before when I got sick. Why this one? We cannot move on until we eliminate all this mass testing. Yes test for confirmation before administering something specific to Covid but testing somebody whose only medical issue is so…

Testing is so you know if you have COVID and you don't go and spread it. And the reason you don't go and spread it is because hospitals have limited capacity - and healthcare workers haver limited energy - so we want to avoid people dying due to lack of proper medical care.

This has been the entire point of mitigation efforts from day one.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#804

Post by elihu » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:32 PM UTC

twblalock wrote: post #409

VeninVidiaVicii wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is effectively a disconnect between science and public policy. Science teaches us to keep our minds open to new data, so we can make new conclusions as we go. People just seem to get pissed when public policy changes in light of new data, lending to the narrative that scientists don't know what they're talking about.

It's not policy change that is the problem, the problem is that nobody can figure out what the current policy is because the CDC is bad at making announcements. Furthermore, there is now widespread suspicion that the CDC's current recommendations are not based on science anymore: for example, the 5-day vs 10-day isolation period. What's especially bad is the advice not to use tests after 5 days, followed a few days l…

I think that sums it up pretty well: people would be more tolerant of the CDC changing their minds on things if it was clear how they arrived at their decisions in the first place and they say what data they base their decisions on and what the trade-offs are.

People will put up with just about anything if they think there's a good reason for it, but if instructions seem arbitrary then people tend to stop giving officials the benefit of the doubt.

Transparency can go along way towards maintaining public trust. I'd rather the CDC err on the side of over-sharing than the reverse.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#805

Post by s5300 » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:32 PM UTC

afavour wrote: post #435

mizzack wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've got your anecdotes, and I've got mine. My 3 young kids all caught omicron last week. Each were lethargic for a day, had a minor sore throat, and were back to normal in a day or two. The flu last month was way scarier with high fevers. There's a lot of reason to be optimistic about omicron.

I kind of regret even mentioning the effects of COVID in my original comment as I figured there would be a reply like yours and you're not wrong! But it wasn't the main point I was trying to make. My main point is that everyone just seems to have moved on from under 5s. We've adopted a stance of "vaxxed and done" for adults and older children and paid no attention to the vax trials for under 5s taking forever. It's b…

I also like the fact that nobody seems to be concerned with the possible effects this virus could have long-term on the developmental growth of a child under 5… I think I would be much more concerned about that than the symptoms of the initial infection itself.

& for those who want to go “buhh we don’t know how duh vaccine will effect their developmental growth either” - I don’t have much to say to you other than I wish you had an education…

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#806

Post by StanislavPetrov » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:32 PM UTC

jewayne wrote: post #493

TimTheTinker wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

I think you've got the causation wrong. People didn't start rejecting the vaccine because of the mandates. Mandates came about because large percentages of the population weren't getting vaccinated. And why weren't they getting vaccinated? Because COVID denial poisoned the well of information. Even today, there are virtually no facts about COVID that you could get 95% of Americans to agree upon. My guess is that clos…

>Because COVID denial poisoned the well of information.

You sure it was "COVID denial" that poisoned the well of information and not:

1) Health officials lying about masks at the start of the pandemic 2) Government officials encouraging people to crowd into primary booths during the height of the pandemic to vote in the Democratic primary. 3) Health and government officials declaring that it was safe to attend riots and mass street protests, but not to go out for any other reasons. 4) That it was a racist conspiracy theory that COVID was created in a lab and not started by people eating bats in China. 5) That the vaccines were safe and effective, and that you couldn't get or spread COVID if you were vaccinated. 6) That vaccines would never be mandated. 7) That its absolutely essential that every receive(at least) a 3rd dose of the vaccine as a "booster" when even the most favorable studies show that "boosters" reduce the odds of serious illness and death only by fractions of a thousandth of a percentage point.

At this point the well contains no water at all - just poisons - and it isn't the skeptics who are responsible. At this point anyone who isn't skeptical about what they are being told by our Dear Leaders has their head buried deep in the sand.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#807

Post by hammock » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:32 PM UTC

scottLobster wrote: post #649

defaultprimate wrote: post #533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

So I'll ask the same question that I've yet to receive a concrete response to: How long is long enough before you'll trust the vaccine? A solid number, in years please. Every anti-vaxxer I've asked that to has hand-waved the question away, because they know if they say something like "I need a minimum of 20 years before I'll trust a vaccine" they'll sound paranoid, which they are. Also their timespan is almost certai…

>So I'll ask the same question that I've yet to receive a concrete response to: How long is long enough before you'll trust the vaccine?

At this point it's not a matter of time in many cases, because it's already been shown in the data for certain demographics that the personal risk is not worth the personal benefit.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#808

Post by andrewclunn » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:35 PM UTC

Animats wrote: post #541

We still don't know if the omicron variant leads to "long COVID".[1] We'll know some time in February. That has a big effect on what to do next. Omicron-specific vaccines are in test. Moderna's should be out in Fall 2022. Pfizer claims March 2022.[2] The next generation in vaccine technology is the US Army / Walter Reed Medical Center broad-spectrum vaccine. This should protect against all COVID and SARS variants.[3]…

Harboring concern over long term risks of covid because o f lack of data, but unconcerned about long term risks from vaccines for covid because of lack of data? You MAY be brainwashed.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#809

Post by imgabe » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:36 PM UTC

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #345

nradov wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

RSV is more dangerous than COVID-19 for most small children. We don't shut down society because of RSV. https://www.medscape.com/answers/971488-177692/what-is-the-p...

> RSV is more dangerous than COVID-19 for most small children. Children don’t exist in isolation. They’re phenomenally good at spreading every infection to the rest of the household and everywhere else they go. Trying to focus on children's outcomes and ignoring all of the second-order effects is dishonest. Children don’t live alone.

And as TFA says, the rest of society is “vaxxed and done”. So why are we harming children by closing schools to “protect” people who are going out to bars and restaurants?

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#810

Post by armadsen » Mon, Jan 10, 2022, 10:36 PM UTC

jewayne wrote: post #493

TimTheTinker wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

I think you've got the causation wrong. People didn't start rejecting the vaccine because of the mandates. Mandates came about because large percentages of the population weren't getting vaccinated. And why weren't they getting vaccinated? Because COVID denial poisoned the well of information. Even today, there are virtually no facts about COVID that you could get 95% of Americans to agree upon. My guess is that clos…

> My guess is that close to 5% would disagree with the statement "the SARS-CoV-2 virus is real". I wouldn't be surprised if the number is even higher than that.

Anecdotally, my mom didn't believe it was a real virus even after I got it, tested positive, and got pretty sick in 2020. When she and my unvaccinated dad got it in summer 2021 and Dad was hospitalized with severe illness from it, she changed her mind on it being real, but is still convinced there are conspiratorial forces behind it, the vaccine, public health measures, etc.