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More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

theatlantic.com

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Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#491

Post by purephase »

jorblumesea wrote: post #411
wonderwonder wrote: post #124

I am one of those, triple vaxxed and done. CDC has now said that the majority of those that died had 4+ co-morbidities. They have also indicated that getting vaccinated does not reduce your ability to spread the virus. So if that is the case, there is no longer a real need to vilify the unvaxxed. CDC statement appears to indicate that the primary reason for people dying is poor physical health prior to infection. Wit…

> So if that is the case, there is no longer a real need to vilify the unvaxxed. This is such a bad take. Unvaxxed cause the majority of hospitalizations, deaths and complications. This is just objectively wrong that it doesn't matter that much.

Agreed. It's also likely that the unvaxxed could be accounting for a greater part of the overall spread too. They tend to be sicker for longer, and given their anti-vax proclivities, will likely not wear masks and continue about their normal daily activities spreading it far and wide.

The same people who are vaccinated are the same ones who will likely isolate/mask-up if they catch the disease.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#492

Post by shigawire »

cryptonector wrote: post #151
dragontamer wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - What is the average level of risk to someone taking reasonable personal precautions? Depends on how full hospitals get. We all get into accidents. We fall and hit our heads, we might get a heart attack, a pregnancy might suddenly go bad and a C-section (or worse surgery) is needed. As COVID19 fills up hospitals around the country, the risk isn't from Omicron itself anymore, as much as it is from an overburdened h…

News flash: hospitals are businesses, and like all businesses, they are most profitable when running at close to capacity, therefore they're at close to capacity most of the time because staffing is sized accordingly.

Which raises the separate point that they should probably not be businesses. A lot of our difficulties here go back to this privatized approach.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#493

Post by jewayne »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #376
snowwrestler wrote: post #133

I feel like COVID has become like a marshmallow test for adults, where those who can manage their emotions and make rational decisions can set themselves up for greater long-term rewards. It looked for a while there like this could be a thing that gets “done”—that we would get a good vaccine into enough people, then incidence would decline so far it just goes away. That didn’t happen. We’re stuck with it for a forese…

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

I think you've got the causation wrong. People didn't start rejecting the vaccine because of the mandates. Mandates came about because large percentages of the population weren't getting vaccinated. And why weren't they getting vaccinated? Because COVID denial poisoned the well of information. Even today, there are virtually no facts about COVID that you could get 95% of Americans to agree upon. My guess is that close to 5% would disagree with the statement "the SARS-CoV-2 virus is real".

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#494

Post by slices »

warning26 wrote: post #438
40four wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the long term of effects of the vaccines are still very unclear. For adults and children. There are concerning reports regarding serious complications that tend to not get talked about very much in the media I chose to vaccinate myself. I don’t have kids, but I’m not sure it would be a given that I would vaccinate them yet. I think I would want to have a better understanding of the risks. Sorry you’re in…

If you're interested in Malone, I definitely recommend reading the Atlantic article about him: https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/08/robert-m... TLDR: he got spurned early on in his career, is bitter about it, and seems to be willing to say just about anything as long as someone will give him some modicum of fame.

If you're interested in Malone, don't just read that hit piece, written by an author who had previously stuck to woke issues.

Wikipedia's not perfect, but his article there would be an improvement.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#495

Post by kimmeld »

mizzack wrote: post #246
afavour wrote: post #129

I'm vaxxed. I'm boosted. I'd very much like to be done. But my children cannot be vaccinated. As a parent of a young kid it kind of feels like everyone has just moved on. I know folks in here will tell me that statistically speaking my children are unlikely to be hospitalized and so on, and I agree. But I know enough kids who got COVID and suffered the symptoms (e.g. a months-long scratchy cough) that I'm not going t…

You've got your anecdotes, and I've got mine. My 3 young kids all caught omicron last week. Each were lethargic for a day, had a minor sore throat, and were back to normal in a day or two. The flu last month was way scarier with high fevers. There's a lot of reason to be optimistic about omicron.

No post body was provided.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#496

Post by fallingknife »

mattnewton wrote: post #163
fallingknife wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But anybody who I spread it to and is vaxxed also has minimal, acceptable risk. If they aren't vaxed, that's on them.

That's not true of the immunocompromised, the rare few who actually couldn't get the fully vaccine because of a reaction to the first dose, the elderly and others with co-morbidities they might not even know about. Those people, along with the unvaccinated, are still going to overwhelm the hospitals if everyone doesn't attempt to limit the spread with measures like masking and testing.

Flu is also dangerous to these people but we never wore masks. This is an edge case and it is the responsibility of these people to protect themselves.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#497

Post by efficax »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #376
snowwrestler wrote: post #133

I feel like COVID has become like a marshmallow test for adults, where those who can manage their emotions and make rational decisions can set themselves up for greater long-term rewards. It looked for a while there like this could be a thing that gets “done”—that we would get a good vaccine into enough people, then incidence would decline so far it just goes away. That didn’t happen. We’re stuck with it for a forese…

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

When your "matter of principle" is avoiding a vaccine you're rationalizing an irrational choice through the mask of a "principle". There's no principle involved (personal liberty? do you also refuse to pay taxes, drive without a license, etc. freedom is a complicated thing)

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#498

Post by nostrademons »

ya_throw wrote: post #284
nostrademons wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The challenge is the lack of data on long-term effects of COVID. Preliminary studies have linked it to cognitive declines [1], diabetes [2], and chronic fatigue [3]. And while death from COVID in a preschooler is about a 1-in-100,000 occurrence, long COVID and other chronic outcomes seem to be much more common. I've heard figures of about 5% or 1 in 20. Few parents would willingly sign their preschooler (or themselve…

Where have you heard those figures from? (I assume you are telling me that 5% of pre-schoolers, in your experience, have had chronic outcomes from Covid). Yes, I have seen many preliminary studies linking Covid to many different long-term health problems [1]. Personally, and especially as Covid has been around for over 2 years at this point, I strongly prefer to avoid the obvious long-term damage caused to my kids by…

I listed sources in my original comment. From the first link, they observed 4.8% of lab-confirmed cases exhibited continuing symptoms, and the average effect on cognitive performance was 0.47 standard deviations (equivalent to about 8 IQ points, or roughly the effect of a stroke). The CDC study has some methodological problems (detailed in nradov & DannyCasolaro's sibling posts), but previous meta-analyses have documented similar effects; they covered only severely-ill patients, but came up with a pooled proportion of 14%. Chronic fatigue is reported as a symptom 6 months following in 46% of cases [2], but again, that study is for adults.

[1] https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/11/18/1055071...

[2] https://www.mdpi.com/2076-3425/11/6/760

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#499

Post by sobellian »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #376
snowwrestler wrote: post #133

I feel like COVID has become like a marshmallow test for adults, where those who can manage their emotions and make rational decisions can set themselves up for greater long-term rewards. It looked for a while there like this could be a thing that gets “done”—that we would get a good vaccine into enough people, then incidence would decline so far it just goes away. That didn’t happen. We’re stuck with it for a forese…

> I know someone who almost quit a great job because they were mad about a vaccine mandate from their employer. [...] That is what failing the marshmallow test looks like. Or perhaps it's a matter of personal principle. Personal conscience and conviction used to be held sacred in the US ... to the point that conscientious objectors wouldn't be forced to fight in wars (they could be assigned to work as medics in Army…

Scattershot vaccine mandates have increased the number of vaccinated. Those left will naturally have resisted some amount of authority, but that observation basically amounts to survivor bias - and it doesn't explain why those individuals failed to get the vaccine before there ever was a mandate.

Re: More Americans are saying they’re ‘vaxxed and done’

#500

Post by fourstar »

titzer wrote: post #113

I've gone through cycles with this. Mostly I am done arguing. I hate arguing about this. It's just more of the culture war shit that so many different media sources love pushing to keep people amped up. I double vaxxed and boosted. Stopped wearing a mask for the most part, but with Omicron I started wearing a mask again because I just don't want this stupid virus. I'm healthy and would probably not have a symptomatic…

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