51–60 of 332 posts
I'm generally a fan of simple systems that don't do much controlled by simple text files. Maybe systemd is way better at runit for more complex workloads than a desktop or a simple server. But maybe it isn't. The intersection of people who like systemd and have tried runit is probably quite a small one!
Excluding the kooks angered enough to send hate mail to the systemd developers, I can understand the old criticisms and aggravation from sysv folks. I was front and center as a relatively new user of Fedora at the time systemd was adopted. While I was familiar with sysv, I wasn't attached to it. I also found sysv a lot more confounding and obscure than systemd in the early days, even though the transition did have rough spots. But I'm definitely attached to systemd now.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
it's kind of like locked bootloaders and pentalobe screwdrivers for organizing a unix system where most users were used to easy to inspect and modify scripts and single purpose programs . yes, it's still open source, but modifications and inspection are far more complicated creating a much higher barrier to entry. in the earlier days when it was still buggy, even linus himself was screaming about not being able to ea…
Right. I have a simple rule: don’t use a GNU/Linux system that uses systemd. It doesn’t respect the Unix philosophy. It’s trying to turn it into Windows. I’m waiting for Microsoft to buy Red Hat. Failing that, IBM.
I use phusion/baseimage-docker[1] right now, love every bit of it. Having the database, web server(nginx) and the java backend all in one place works beautifully.
The only pain point is having to write `runit` scripts for startup and shutdown for each service, hence the wish for Systemd inside containers.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
When waiting for units to shut down, have you tried pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times? It forces a reboot, and you can turn the machine off before linux has taken over again.
> have you tried pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times? It forces a reboot Not sure if serious? At that point, how is that any better than just using Windows? "Press Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times" has long been SOP there.
Color me as part of the anti-systemd crowd, but i still got to support it on machines where i didn't get to choose.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Right. I have a simple rule: don’t use a GNU/Linux system that uses systemd. It doesn’t respect the Unix philosophy. It’s trying to turn it into Windows. I’m waiting for Microsoft to buy Red Hat. Failing that, IBM.
I mean, emacs doesn't respect the UNIX philosophy either, but that's one of the most praised pieces of software to come out of the UNIX space. The UNIX philosophy isn't meant to be taken as gospel - hell, it's very hard to define what "doing one thing" even means.
This was an amazing review, and love systemd or hate it, this article gives a fantastic history and exposition of what systemd actually is . My favorite quote (and when taken in context is much less tongue-in-cheek thank you might think): systemd is an event-driven object manager with dependency-like side effects which ‘boxes’ primitive kernel resources and userspace subsystems into a generic object type called Unit.…
I’m a fan of this description. It might not be the easiest to understand or the first one you should read, but I wish more things had this kind of description somewhere (but not necessarily on the introductory materials or front page).
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m young enough to have missed the transition and really like systemd, I rely on it for as much as I can
Like what if you don't mind me asking, and what did people used to use as an alternative?
https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/4lzxs3/why_did_a... quote: "What most systemd critics consider "bloat", I consider necessary complexity to solve a complex problem generically. " endquote
I use archlinux as a daily driver, but it breaks far more randomly than gentoo ever did for me. Archlinux's bugzilla is full of random breakages that happen at random system updates. Here's a random python bug that been happening, cost me a couple of hours to debug and for now I don't update python until they get around fixing it[1]. The fix? Download an older python version(not too old since that would break everyth…
I think I'm just used to the installer. I like doing everything by CLI. Ubuntu is always trying to push something odd like Snap, and I think Xubuntu is defunct. The Ubuntu installers are very opinionated on what kind of desktop they want you to have.
One of these days I'll just buy all the ThinkPenguin stuff and go to FOSS-only Debian with xfce. Debian has a great installer, too. Then I'll turn my desktops into cattle-style systems where I blow up the rootfs once a year for full system updates.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
When waiting for units to shut down, have you tried pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times? It forces a reboot, and you can turn the machine off before linux has taken over again.
> have you tried pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times? It forces a reboot Not sure if serious? At that point, how is that any better than just using Windows? "Press Ctrl+Alt+Delete 7 times" has long been SOP there.
I didn't even know Windows did this. This is going to save my butt some day.