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We need to reclaim our attention

theguardian.com

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Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#51

Post by howenterprisey »

jarvist wrote: post #28
wrnr wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire way the old media reports on the new media is unironical scaremongering about how the internet is hacking the fear response of your amygdala. They should instead be positive and publish articles like "Here are 10 youtube channels that go into more depth that the master program of any university".

Could you point me in the direction of a single YouTube channel that goes into more depth than a Masters program? Other than occasional captured lectures, everything 'educational' on YouTube seems to me to be optimising for that TED-style sense of wonder / happy familiarisation with the content, which is poorly associated with learning outcomes.

The "occasional captured lectures" are still pretty strong. Off the top of my head, here are two lectures:

https://youtu.be/5ESJH1NLMLs "Children of the Magenta Line" by Warren Vanderburgh https://youtu.be/YvEB05xdAy4 "Total Synthesis of Vitamin B12" by RB Woodward

You may tell me I'm cheating by posting videos that are obviously not "native" to YouTube, but YouTube was the way I found them, how I watch them, and how I share them with other people.

OK, so YouTube-native videos are hard mode. Try https://youtu.be/WHASYE2e5Xo I suppose? I like it. It has life lessons I'd argue are at least as valuable as the videos you're thinking about.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#52

Post by jacquesm »

batch12 wrote: post #48
jacquesm wrote: post #8

There is a veritable war going on for your attention, and the battlefields are your eyeballs, your ears and ultimately your brain. Psychologists have been enlisted, as they are in every war to try to win it for 'their side', be it one of the big silos or some dying TV or newspaper era behemoth, there is no reasonable way in which you can withstand that kind of frontal onslaught. The only way to really deal with this…

Yes. People talk about addiction to social media or other attention-farming software, but not many people really take it seriously. People think they are unicorns and while some can get addicted or manipulated-- they think "not me. I am too savvy." As long this issue just keeps getting shrugged off as a new version of tv-is-bad hysteria 'media' companies will keep making their dollars and enslaving the minds of the t…

One form this takes is that people with some regularity claim that 'all this advertising doesn't work on them' while having an iPhone, ridiculously over-priced in ear headphones, designer clothes with large logos on them and shoes with very visible branding.

Advertising works, on everybody. The only way to get to a level playing field is to filter it out of your life as much as possible. The only thing I haven't found a solution for is billboards and radios and TVs playing in places that I have no control over.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#53

Post by kordlessagain »

jarvist wrote: post #28
wrnr wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire way the old media reports on the new media is unironical scaremongering about how the internet is hacking the fear response of your amygdala. They should instead be positive and publish articles like "Here are 10 youtube channels that go into more depth that the master program of any university".

Could you point me in the direction of a single YouTube channel that goes into more depth than a Masters program? Other than occasional captured lectures, everything 'educational' on YouTube seems to me to be optimising for that TED-style sense of wonder / happy familiarisation with the content, which is poorly associated with learning outcomes.

Just search for this video will make you angry.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#54

Post by lacerus »

radicalbyte wrote: post #18

My attention has collapsed in recent times, but it's not because of mobiles. It's because I have three young kids. You literally have to keep your eye on them at all times so you stop them killing themselves. Also, going from 8 hrs of sleep a night + 1 hr of intensive sport a day to 4-5 hrs of sleep a night and 1 hr of sport a year is an absolute mind killer. When I was younger I could never imagine going into manage…

This 100x! I am in the same boat, ours are 4 and 2. I recently installed rings and a super sturdy pull up bar next to the kids room and hope to do some basic calisthenics there with the kids before putting them to bed. Wish me luck. So far they really like it and I get at least a mini-workout out of it. Nothing like an hour at a real gym, but better than nothing.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#55

Post by batch12 »

slibhb wrote: post #42

> Some scientists say these worries about attention are a moral panic, comparable to the anxieties in the past about comic books or rap music, and that the evidence is shaky. I agree with them. It's hard to pay attention to something for long unless it's entertaining. Reading a book, reading a paper, etc -- these activities take discipline that most people don't develop or don't often apply. This isn't new. The mista…

Respectfully, these examples- radio and TV aren't even in the same league as the manipulation and engagement that comes from the algorithmic feedback loop that backs these services. The comparison is dangerously dismissive.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#56

Post by abledon »

slibhb wrote: post #42

> Some scientists say these worries about attention are a moral panic, comparable to the anxieties in the past about comic books or rap music, and that the evidence is shaky. I agree with them. It's hard to pay attention to something for long unless it's entertaining. Reading a book, reading a paper, etc -- these activities take discipline that most people don't develop or don't often apply. This isn't new. The mista…

whenever the power goes off in my house for long periods, its as if some super power hits and i can read books with a new found attention span

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#57

Post by datavirtue »

batch12 wrote: post #48
jacquesm wrote: post #8

There is a veritable war going on for your attention, and the battlefields are your eyeballs, your ears and ultimately your brain. Psychologists have been enlisted, as they are in every war to try to win it for 'their side', be it one of the big silos or some dying TV or newspaper era behemoth, there is no reasonable way in which you can withstand that kind of frontal onslaught. The only way to really deal with this…

Yes. People talk about addiction to social media or other attention-farming software, but not many people really take it seriously. People think they are unicorns and while some can get addicted or manipulated-- they think "not me. I am too savvy." As long this issue just keeps getting shrugged off as a new version of tv-is-bad hysteria 'media' companies will keep making their dollars and enslaving the minds of the t…

Yeah, that was the point of the shill OP. Nothing to see hear folks...move along.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#58

Post by thegrimmest »

sascha_sl wrote: post #13
mypastself wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except I have no choice but to walk through an area which might be polluted. I do have a choice to not read news sites for four hours a day. The article fails to define both the problem and the solution. How exactly this “attention theft” causes significant negative societary consequences is defined extremely vaguely, and almost exclusively through personal anecdotes. The offered solutions, forcing employers to respe…

"Choice" really needs to be well-defined here. We know you can influence people to change their behavior because we invented the term "attention hacking". Sheer willpower will not overcome this on anything but an individual level. And just like obesity has other dependents like the cost of food, there is also cost/disincentives to "disconnecting". Social interaction is almost exclusively happening online now, especia…

I'd say "choice" in the conventional sense - the exercise of voluntary control over one's body. If sheer willpower can overcome this on an individual level then it can overcome it on a societal level, society being nothing more than a collection of individuals.

It seems as though you're suggesting that we use authority to "solve" these "systemic" issues - which really are just individual issues for a subset of the population. This suggests that you are comfortable deciding what's good for others. How would you respond to obese or social-media-obsessed people who are content with their lives and not interested in your "solutions"?

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#59

Post by wrnr »

jarvist wrote: post #28
wrnr wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire way the old media reports on the new media is unironical scaremongering about how the internet is hacking the fear response of your amygdala. They should instead be positive and publish articles like "Here are 10 youtube channels that go into more depth that the master program of any university".

Could you point me in the direction of a single YouTube channel that goes into more depth than a Masters program? Other than occasional captured lectures, everything 'educational' on YouTube seems to me to be optimising for that TED-style sense of wonder / happy familiarisation with the content, which is poorly associated with learning outcomes.

For real, learn to abuse youtube and twitter algo's. I get random suggestions like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vq2BxAJZ4Tc&list=PLUZ0A4xAf7...

Math and art are thing I like, just keep hard blocking stuff you don't like and upvote stuff you do.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#60

Post by mypastself »

kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #14

Arguably the iPad technology for viewing plastic plants in VR is more interesting than plastic plants in a room. The author also seems to be very "unlucky" to have a relative who supposedly can't cope with normal live because of all the distractions.

Yeah, the man was clearly impressed by the tech, and the author’s comment was uncalled for. He was lucky the man didn’t deck him.
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